tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post8989790584185960761..comments2024-03-18T15:40:57.986-04:00Comments on The Manson Family Blog: A Look At the Evidence #3: The Death of Steven Parent (Who told it best?)Matthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06766282574442161929noreply@blogger.comBlogger63125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-46070201536723965072021-09-06T11:00:48.474-04:002021-09-06T11:00:48.474-04:00I also tend to believe that Parent may well have p...I also tend to believe that Parent may well have parked *beside* the garage, directly under the light, rather than directly next to Folger's Camaro, right in front of the house. This is because he was basically a sort of nerd, I think, aspiring to a connection with glamour, and so would have lacked the confidence to pull up to the very front of the house, thereby attracting the attention of the occupants.<br /><br />So, you know, he may have serendipitously actually been inside of his car, before starting it, dome light unilluminated, when they came over the hillside, near gate button. It would explain why he is reported to have said, "I won't tell" just before Watson shot him.shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-17459684455666475922021-09-06T10:51:45.478-04:002021-09-06T10:51:45.478-04:00That's an excellent point.
This has strong c...That's an excellent point. <br /><br />This has strong credibility, since it was reported by the LA Times delivery man who came by at between 4:30 and 5AM, which would still be dark.<br /><br />I've not yet seen a clear picture of where the bug light was located, but the most likely place would be at the extreme end of the garage, up the stairs near the above-garage room. Looking at the pictures I have links to, I can't see it, and if there, it probably is, as you say, beside the upstairs door, serving to light the landing so that someone who went up there after dark could unlock the door.<br /><br />Ah, OK. Now I think I see it. It appears to be a floodlight, maybe paired, just about at the last step of the stairs to the above garage landing. It is from a photo of the location of Parent's car.<br /><br />If this is more-or-less correct, there'd be a fair amount of light out there.<br /><br />I haven't posted here in about 2 years. Taken as a set of verifiable facts and trying to align them with all versions of testimony is very intriguing. My gut feeling is that the official story, as per Bugliosi, is not far from the actual event. I think he wanted an understandable scenario for the jury and hence he simplified it, and I now have doubts that Manson ordered the killings to initiate a race war. I think it was probably more spontaneous than that--whimsical, almost.<br /><br />Too, after an interim of two years, thinking on it occasionally, I do believe that some very serious errors may have been made in collecting blood evidence. I do not think that parts of the blood evidence are reliable, but that some is.<br /><br />Alternatively, the killers were so drenched in blood that it dripped from them in locations that are wildly inconsistent with any reasonable actual scenario. This is consistent with deciding to stop and wash themselves off.<br /><br />Just a good way to spend excess mental energy!<br />shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-6993716041233922202021-09-05T20:27:37.109-04:002021-09-05T20:27:37.109-04:00I'm continuing to have another look at these e...I'm continuing to have another look at these excellent posts, hence this late comment. One thing I did not see discussed in this post is the fact that the bug light on the garage was on. In fact, it was still on when Mrs Chapman arrived on Saturday morning about 8:30am.<br /><br />Why I think this is relevant is that that light most likely illuminated the parking area. If one looks closely at photos of the garage, an exterior light is clearly visible on the side of the door of the above-garage room. Depending on the wattage of the light, this may have illuminated this area of the garage fairly well.<br /><br />This may be important in that the killers may have been able to see Steve before they ever saw his headlights. Moreover, Steve could have thereby also seen the killers as they entered the property.<br /><br />In the trial of Manson and the girls( I think), Bugliosi asks Linda about a light on the garage. I don't have immediate access to the trial transcript, but I'd like to know if the bug light was the light in question, or if it was another light. Perhaps it was a flood light on the front of the garage. Either way, there was undoubtedly some illumination of the parking area on the night of the murders <br /><br />Torquehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00444301737391992929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-52223459105954966612021-01-20T16:27:22.407-05:002021-01-20T16:27:22.407-05:00Blogger TheStonesUnturned said...
A bunch of stuf...Blogger TheStonesUnturned said...<br /><br />A bunch of stuff<br /><br />---------------------------------------------------------------------<br /><br />Wow, you are all over the place like a mad womans dinner.<br /><br />4 shots fired at 11.45? Since when?<br /><br />Parent burglarising the house and shot by Frykowski?<br /><br />And Steve's glasses were found...guess where? On his head.<br /><br />I think you skipped your medication.<br /><br />Also, yanno. Punctuation.Tragical History Tourhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16419266493227241434noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-52871070538707650542020-08-11T08:40:43.408-04:002020-08-11T08:40:43.408-04:00NONE of this "testimony" explains the st...NONE of this "testimony" explains the stab wound in Parent's left hand. At all. Also, when "Tex" shot him, why didn't his car keep driving? Did Parent put the car in "Park" before he got shot? It was found next morning with the key "off" and the console shifter in "2nd." In that state, it could have been pushed out of the way (why? Supposedly, the killers did not arrive by car. Unless the real killers DID. Were they ALREADY there, and had to push Steven's car out of the way in order to LEAVE?) If he had to put the car in "Park" and get out to find/reach the open button, then that might explain why it didn't drive into the gate on its own after he got shot. And maaaayyyybe how he got stabbed in the hand. But of course, Bugliosi doesn't try to figure out what happened. He just wants the publicity for his book, so he needs a Halloween story to sell. Another thing that never gets explained is, how did Sharon/Jay's blood get on the inside gate button? Was it on Steven's hand? But his hand was bleeding from a stab wound, and his blood type was B/MN. The blood on the inside gate button was type "O" (no subgroup testing.) Did one of them run to the gate, trying to escape, and get caught and dragged back? If the killers had their blood on his hands as he left, then why didn't he leave any bloody fingerprints at the scene? Again, Bugliosi didn't care about what really happened. He was writing a TV movie of the week (literally.) Now, the glasses found next to the trunks look EXACTLY like the ones Parent is wearing in the known photos. His blood type was found on the trunks. Was he caught by Frykowski trying to burgle the house (he had a record for burglary. And that .22 Buntline was stolen from a house in his neighborhood after he got out of juvie) and and he got cut struggling with Frykowski and drop the gun? Did Frykowski take his gun away from him, chase him out to his car, and shoot him? According to ALL the witnesses in the neighborhood, there were four shots fired about 11:45 (thirtyish minutes after he supposedly left Garretson's house...where was he? What was he doing, if he wasn't sneaking around inside the house?) and then THREE HOURS went by until screams and three more gunshots were heard between 3:30 and 4:00. So, what happened during those THREE HOURS? Did Frykowski call his good buddy and partner in amateur crime, Pic Dawson, and ask him what to do? Somebody left the door open, and the wrong dogs came home. Did Pic call a "cleaner" and send him over to 10050 Cielo Drive? Did that situation go from bad to worse?TheStonesUnturnedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03708617965747203575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-52092566632551175492020-08-11T08:20:50.502-04:002020-08-11T08:20:50.502-04:00According to WHAT? What report states he was weari...According to WHAT? What report states he was wearing his glasses? There are two lists of items: One is a list of items found in Steven's car, including the watch found in the back seat. NOTHING about glasses. There is another report of his personal items including clothing, shoes, socks, etc. NOTHING about glasses. So, where are you getting this information that "he was wearing his glasses when found?"TheStonesUnturnedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03708617965747203575noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-41592606712780614292020-07-12T10:34:08.737-04:002020-07-12T10:34:08.737-04:00They are not his glasses. he was wearing his glass...They are not his glasses. he was wearing his glasses when found.Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06551377673977145628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-56072393347525422652020-07-09T09:50:52.408-04:002020-07-09T09:50:52.408-04:00Why his glasses are in the living room near Sharon...Why his glasses are in the living room near Sharon Tate's steamer trunks, if he was with William Garretson?lookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15688943462244391167noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-33915214953193024042019-08-27T16:35:12.168-04:002019-08-27T16:35:12.168-04:00Send it.Send it.Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06551377673977145628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-42961151296892090862019-08-26T21:03:34.226-04:002019-08-26T21:03:34.226-04:00David,
If we're talking about that side-discu...David,<br /><br />If we're talking about that side-discussion a couple of weeks back, I've got another section queued up ready to send, if this is of interest. It has annotated drawings and photos so I can't post here as a comment. I can email, however.<br /><br />I do realize, however, that a lo of the stuff I'm coming up is re-inventing the wheel; a lot of other analytical people here have already thought of it. At best, my stuff has value, if any, as an independently run test, uninfluenced by other readings/opinions here. So in some cases, I'm independently replicating earlier findings, and of course, I'm learning a lot.<br /><br />Let me know.shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-71643807281664362712019-08-26T20:43:58.236-04:002019-08-26T20:43:58.236-04:00Shoegazer said: "WRT Atkins stabbing Frykowsk...Shoegazer said: "WRT Atkins stabbing Frykowski initially, I can buy into that."<br /><br />Unless we are missing a knife the 3/4 inch wounds to Frykowski's back have to have been made by the knife found at the scene. they are too deep to be either of the other two weapons identifiable from the reports. If we accept that Atkins lost her knife at the scene then A+B= C. Or or you prefer, Occam's Razor. That is the simplest explanation. <br /><br />PS: I didn't mean by my comment via e-mail that the subject had run its course. I meant that part. I don't know if you brought your next here but just an FYI. Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06551377673977145628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-74763754447132400862019-08-26T19:27:02.895-04:002019-08-26T19:27:02.895-04:00Ultimately I'm OK with the fact that we'll...Ultimately I'm OK with the fact that we'll never have definitive answers. Naturally, I would prefer it if we did, but this won't happen in my lifetime, and likely never will happen. That leaves us to speculate, which is interesting.<br /><br />One of the easiest first triages is to throw out what is very unlikely to have happened in favor of answers that are more economical--Occam's Razor stuff, then examine the resultant hypothesis and test it. Then swap out one significant variation and test the whole hypothesis again to see if is is as strong, less strong, or stronger.<br /><br />Just keep working thru the variables that way and you can get some fairly satisfying results, but of course none will be definitive.<br /><br />WRT Atkins stabbing Frykowski initially, I can buy into that. I spent some time with the autopsy report and the various testimony and I can see a way that Frykowksi made his initial break and was turned in such a fashion that it was reasonable to think that Atkins, wielding the knife right-handed, in a hammer grip, got him a number of times in the right back. At that time he grappled with her, and I can also see that if he was behind her, if she could turn about 45 degrees to her left, she could have also inflicted the leg wounds.shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-17932172773647043802019-08-26T18:52:00.216-04:002019-08-26T18:52:00.216-04:00Shoegazer,
Having been to the site if there was ...Shoegazer, <br /><br />Having been to the site if there was police activity to preserve the crime scene the cars would have lined up outside the gate, like they did and likely all the way down Cielo, which is little more than a one lane street and not very long. It is a 3 minute walk. I would estimate that it would be hard to make a three point turn on Cielo it is that narrow. <br /><br />That said, it is ludicrous. The trip from Spahn to Cielo by the most direct route existing at the time cannot be done in less than 45 minutes and IMO that would have bene pushing it (and 'yes' I mean in light or no traffic). I once penciled it out and if I recall I estimated any such return, given everything you mention and some prep time at Spahn and the 'questionable' proof of the 1:00 a.m. hose bib encounter, put Manson arriving at Cielo shortly before 4 a.m. Sunrise was at 6:10 but it would be getting light per the Framer's Almanac at about 5:45. <br /><br />Shoegazer said: "where did he put the gun and the knife when he reached in to turn off the car and move the gear selector? Where were they when he pushed the car? Not sure how well the area was lighted, but it seems like handing them to someone would be the best thing to do." (and the rest from here)<br /><br />You just hit on one of my pet issues. He can't. Nor can he push the car or toss the rope over the beam and loop it around the necks of Sharon and Gibbie. While they are perhaps minor issues to me they all suggest that he didn't do all of these things or at least we are missing something. <br /><br />At the outset it is easy to pass off certain actions to Watson because he is not there to defend himself and until he found God denied remembering doing much of anything. Later he assumed responsibility for it all. But I have always been left with a nagging feeling he didn't do all these things wielding a gun and a knife. <br /><br />For example I do not believe he stabbed Frykowski until he went out to the lawn. I believe he was wielding only the gun. To me the explains using the gun as a club. If he had a knife why not drop the gun and use that. I believe it was Atkins who was stabbing Frykowski as he fled for the door. Frykowski IMO went down somewhere near the door, perhaps just inside or in the doorway and that is when Watson turned to Gibbie, then engaged with Krenwinkel (and perhaps assisted to some degree by Sharon). <br /><br />Somewhere between bludgeoning Frykowski to the ground and the hallway to the pool Watson acquired a knife and one theory I have pondered is that it was Krenwinkel's knife, that she lost it during her melee and he picked it up. But.....no tapes....no possible answers, just opinion. <br /><br /><br />Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06551377673977145628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-35460750852778567362019-08-26T18:20:19.825-04:002019-08-26T18:20:19.825-04:00Good stuff....
A bit more, if you have time.
It ...Good stuff....<br /><br />A bit more, if you have time.<br /><br /><i><b>It was found in second gear, not park. This led me to ask the gents if it was possible to push it 20' +/- in gear. I was told yes but it was 3-1 that Watson could not have done so alone. </b></i><br /><br />This is still consistent with having put the car in N to push it and then moving the selector to something other than N, because that would be sufficient to make the car relatively immobile, which is what they'd want. Any gear other than N would do, actually.<br /><br />Likely the transmission was of the type that the gear selections were D (high)-D2 (low)-N-R-P. Specific labels would be unimportant, the important thing is that when stopped they put it into something other than N, which makes a lot of sense. From the photo on cielodrive.com, the selector appears to be floor mounted, between the bucket seats. To see the selector Watson would have to lean pretty far in, I think.<br /><br /><i><b>The fingerprint issue has long been used as evidence that Manson returned to the house later that night/morning in part because of the absence of a-e in the testimony/tapes/parole hearings.</b></i><br /><br />Having read something you wrote somewhere, I think you're familiar with the general area of the westside canyons and the Valley and vicinity. I seldom went much north of Sunset except at Sepulveda Canyon (405).I lived at Playa del Rey at first, then later San Pedro. We spent a lot of time in the Santa Monica/Century City/West Hollywood area for dining and entertainment, ate at Yamashiro, Lowry's, etc.<br /><br />I've driven Mulholland several times and drove I-5 & 101 as they run thru the Valley, and Ventura Blvd as it goes west (it is the Valley version of Sunset). So I'm not familiar with the routes from Santa Susana, but my general opinion is that given the stop to wash blood off, the stop for gas on the way back, finding Manson "dancing around naked on the boardwalk" at Spahn, explaining to him what happened, then him thinking about it, then the drive back, not knowing if there was police activity there or not, realizing it was a trap to be down there at the end of the cul de sac *if* the police arrived after you went up there, knowing full well that there had been screaming and shots fired, it seems LUDICROUS to think he would have gone. It would be barely possible time-wise, and simply foolish to do. Risky as hell.<br /><br />Looking at the street maps, if he drove by the most direct route, Benedict Canyon Dr or Beverley Glen Dr , he'd not be able to see police activity until he got past the house. Then he'd have to go back up, taking more time. The more I think about it, the sillier it sounds.<br /><br /><i><b>if I recall correctly was a bit uncertain whether she actually saw Watson push the car. While this isn't helpful because I can't remember where I read it someone once said they all pushed the car. Atkins testified that Watson pushed it alone. </b></i><br /><br />In my opinion, entirely do-able. I have done this myself, often. I had cruddy cars in college and had to push them myself on occasion.<br /><br />An odd question that bothers me: if Watson had a gun in one hand, and a knife in the other, then attacked Parent, where did he put the gun and the knife when he reached in to turn off the car and move the gear selector? Where were they when he pushed the car? Not sure how well the area was lighted, but it seems like handing them to someone would be the best thing to do.<br /><br />I see this same problem popping up during the attack, too; chasing hitting and stabbing Frykowski, etc. Does he carry something in each hand as he bludgeons Frykowski on the head, for example? If he attempts to grapple with Frykoski, it seems like he can't hold both the gun and the knife.shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-88734323343829692052019-08-26T15:44:21.373-04:002019-08-26T15:44:21.373-04:00I can't disagree with parts #1 or #2.
The po...I can't disagree with parts #1 or #2. <br /><br />The point of this post was to attempt to get answers to a couple of points that have come up now and again: <br /><br />1. Why/how did Parent hit the fence. <br />2. To some degree timing but looking at the post in isolation you don't see the posts around this time, especially a very good one by Matt that discussed that issue. <br />3. Try to provide an explanation how Krenwinkel and Atkins only heard the shots and Kasabian saw the shots. <br /><br />On part 3 I have a couple of points. <br /><br />When I wrote this I took a little drive over to an 'antique auto' place near my home and spork with a couple gentleman there. Aside from learning more that I ever thought I'd know about a 1966 AMC Rambler I learned the a couple of other things. <br /><br />The car had an automatic transmission. I believe that is also in the police report or the trial testimony. <br /><br />The ignition was in the 'off' position the next morning and the lights were off, the engine was cool.<br /><br />It was found in second gear, not park. This led me to ask the gents if it was possible to push it 20' +/- in gear. I was told yes but it was 3-1 that Watson could not have done so alone. <br /><br />'Yes' I agree there should have been fingerprints on both the hood of the car, the door frame, and the steering wheel. All of these areas were dusted the next morning and came back with nothing. I don't recall if Parent's fingerprints were on the car. <br /><br />The fingerprint issue has long been used as evidence that Manson returned to the house later that night/morning in part because of the absence of a-e in the testimony/tapes/parole hearings. Kasabian, if I recall correctly was a bit uncertain whether she actually saw Watson push the car. While this isn't helpful because I can't remember where I read it someone once said they all pushed the car. Atkins testified that Watson pushed it alone. <br /><br />From this I actually reached the conclusion, when taken together with the difficult spacial issue at the button that Parent was stopped much closer to where the car came to a rest and not at the button or even near the button. Again, to my frustration at the Grand jury Atkins corrected the location of the car. VB shows her a picture of it the next day and she says something like 'it wasn't there, it was over hear' and VB says closer to the gate and she answers 'Yes'. Where 'over here' was would be interesting.<br /><br />Atkins also testified that Watson turned off the lights right after the shooting and just before he pushed the car. <br /><br />There was human blood on the outside of the door handle which was not described in detail and not enough to type the blood. This could be cast-off (but there noe described on the door itself) or it could be something else such as telltale evidence of someone wiping down the car on the way out, leaning against the door to reach inside, for example. <br /><br />The wrist watch is described in the Property Report as a "Wristwatch-'Lucerne' Man's w/m- broken stretch band."<br /><br /><br /><br />Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06551377673977145628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-4029355569517473852019-08-26T13:24:51.453-04:002019-08-26T13:24:51.453-04:00Thank you for writing these comments, Shoegazer. I...Thank you for writing these comments, Shoegazer. I know it's been said before but I don't see how Tex could push that car uphill by himself, especially holding a gun and a knife. It's a small point to make and possibly he handed them off or set them down and maybe the meth and adrenaline gave him super human strength but it's still a chore with the grading and Parent's body being in the way. I also think it'd be tough to stab and shoot someone a split second apart at close range even with the Buntline's light recoil. It'd be dangerous for Tex's safety for him to hold the long barreled pistol in one hand and shoot it immediately while pulling the knife hand to safety. He'd have to be good with both hands and most people aren't. Certainly not civilians with no training outside of Karate Dave's desert karate school (joke). Yana the 5g witch must've been involved in that attack, at least at the beginning of it. I can't see it any other way. G. Greene-Whytehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16687404262559321867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-65542191161671232232019-08-26T12:41:13.485-04:002019-08-26T12:41:13.485-04:00PART 3
Now, the car's engine would still be r...PART 3<br /><br />Now, the car's engine would still be running, and since it was an automatic transmission (I'm almost sure), it would very slowly creep forward, because in all likelihood, when Parent stopped, he was in Drive, and he stopped by putting his foot on the brake, holding the car in place, like when at a Stop sign. Once his foot was off the pedal, or the force was off the pedal, the car, at idle speed, would tend to creep forward. At this point Watson reached in over the steering wheel and turned off the ignition.<br /><br />Watson said this, and also added that he pushed the car back, more out of sight of the gate, to the spot where it was found, with Parent still in the driver's seat, the next morning. To reposition the car, however, Watson would have to move our of Drive and into Neutral, then cramp the steering wheel toward him, and push the car back. This implies that the lot of 10050 Cielo is fairly level. Watson would then need to push the selector to Park, or the car might roll. I believe the car was found in Park the next morning. As with most automatics of the era, it could not have been pushed forward of backward while in Park.<br /><br />The car's lights likely would have still been on, otherwise it would be hard for Watson to see the gear indicator (D-L-N-R-P). So he probably turned off the lights after he had moved the car.<br /><br />At this point there should have been Watson's finger prints anywhere he touched the car, and most certainly all over the wheel and the gear selector lever. My recollection is that there were none, which implies: <br /><br />a) gloves;<br />b) an immediate wipe down; <br />c) a wipe down by Kasabian on the way out; <br />d) a wipe down by Watson or the females as they left; <br />e) a wipe down by a subsequent visit by a mysterious visitor prior to the arrival of the police; or<br />f) the police simply muffed it.<br /><br />There is no mention in any version of a thru d; e seems absurd on the face of it, when judged in context, and maybe f comes into play; I don't know.<br /><br />END PART 3 - COMPLETEshoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-61523117360573702762019-08-26T12:40:01.123-04:002019-08-26T12:40:01.123-04:00PART 2
As Parent's car approached, he would h...PART 2<br /><br />As Parent's car approached, he would have to have his lights on in order to find the gate button. He may not have been sure exactly where it was, if this was indeed his first visit to Cielo. He may have had to approach the button near the wall slower than he otherwise might have, had he been more familiar with the location of the button.<br /><br />This would give Watson and the others a bit more time to see him and to arrange themselves quickly.<br /><br />Now we have to guess whether Parent found the button, stopped, and Watson jumped out at him shouting "Halt!", or some other related and reasonable sequence occurred.<br /><br />I think it was you that indicated that if Parent had reached the gate button before stopping, there'd be little room (maybe none) for Watson to approach him closely at the driver's side window. Working from this, and from the idea that Parent may have slowed to search with his headlights for the button. Watson might have jumped out in front of the car, gun in right hand, knife in left hand, quickly, forcing parent to either stop or run him down. <br /><br />Once stopped, Watson pointed the gun and walked quickly around the side of the car to the open window (probably because a) it was a warm night, and b) to access the button quickly when he found it), and that's when Parent spoke. <br /><br />Now the defensive wound on the left palm appears to most like be from an upward lunging cut from a knife which by circumstance hooked on the wrist band of Parent's wrist watch. The watch's location on the back seat is consistent with a likely slicing arc from a knife, held with a thrusting grip, in Watson's left hand. My guess is that Watson, when at the open window and hearing Parent's plea, raised the gun to fire into Parent's exposed face, Parent got his left hand up reflexively to protect his face, and Watson lunged out with the knife to parry his hand away, for a clear shot. The lunge likely first encountered the watch strap, cut thru it and then cut deeper into Parent's left palm. This was a deep cut, and the force needed to first cut the strap AND cut to the bone would be considerable. Watson, a former high school athlete of considerable talent, was physically capable inflicting of this sort of wound.<br /><br />It would be good at this point to know what material the watch strap was made of, to help judge the stoke that apparently cut the watch free and inflicted the would.<br /><br />At this point I would speculate that it was most likely that the palm wound, defensive in nature, was the first blood drawn in the attack, with as many as 4 shots following quickly.<br /><br />END PART 2shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-69023632498057417312019-08-26T11:51:30.110-04:002019-08-26T11:51:30.110-04:00PART 1
An excellent article. I'd like to add ...PART 1<br /><br />An excellent article. I'd like to add a few ideas here, belatedly.<br /><br />The location of where parent parked when he visited Garretson is not *really* important, but just to get some resolution in my mind, I'd slightly favor location #6 in the diagram. This is because that Parent, as a fairly clean-cut average American boy of the time would be reluctant to park in a way that would block the egress of any of the other cars he could see, including any cars that may be parked behind the closed left-most garage port.<br /><br />He could park somewhat closer to Folger's car (a bit to the left of #1) and still feel fairly sure that anyone from the main house who wanted to leave could do so unimpeded. So my current guess is he may have pulled far enough forward to see that he'd block egress of the other cars, or any in the closed garage, so he then backed around and pulled into #6, or in some other similarly out-of-the-way spot.<br /><br />This really doesn't matter much.<br /><br />The next aspect *could* affect the timing of his arrival and hence of the crime.<br /><br />Working from memory--which at age 71 is getting flaky as hell--I think I recall that Garretson said, at his polygraph interview, that Parent commented on the attractive women visible thru the window of the main house, as he walked along the walkway to the guest house. While it would be possible to see Folger in the guest bedroom, which had large windows facing the view, if Parent meant that he saw both Tate and Folger, they'd probably still be in the LR, and he'd see them thru the windows there. He could not have seen anything in Tate's BR.<br /><br />Since Folger was in bed but not asleep, and so was Tate (talking to Sebring) when the intrusion happened, Parent might have seen Tate and Folger in the LR a considerable (30 min?) before the entry. This would mainly tell us about the possible length of his stay, but not a lot about the time of the intrusion. <br /><br />(BTW, I am not at this point convinced that the time recorded on the clock radio as either "12:15" or "12:17" is definitive enough to use to set the timing of Parent's departure. If Garretson had independently testified that the clock had been plugged in, had the correct time set, and it was unplugged as Parent left, it would be more valuable, but there are too many uncertainties as it is. If Garretson testified to this, I'm not aware of it.)<br /><br />So far as the stated reason for Parent's visit, to try to sell a clock radio, or to retrieve it from Garretson, this rings odd to me, but the actual reason for the visit does not seem to me to have any substantive bearing on the criminal events.<br /><br />So now we are to when Parent leaves, is stopped and to me inexplicably says something like "I won't tell...", before being killed.<br /><br />First, the longer I think about your idea that, at the moment that Parent was backing around from either #1 or #6, he saw something odd or threatening at the gate, and it distracted his attention to the point that he backed over the restraining cub and broke part of the fence, the more likely it seems. It explains BOTH the reason for breaking the fence, and Parent's odd "I won't tell...".<br /><br />Now that I think about it, if Parent was parked at #1, he may well have begun to back out with his headlights off, to avoid shining into the house and disturbing the occupants. He wouldn't know which rooms might be occupied. Nor would the intruders have seen his headlights even if they were on, since they'd be pointing towards the house at that point.<br /><br />If he was parked at #6, he likely would have turned his lights on immediately, and the intruders would have seen him at that point. However, if at #6 he may have seen the possible activity at the gate as he got to his car, sat in it quietly, then decided to start the car and leave as quickly as he could, backing into the fence with his lights still off, the tuning them on to find the gate button.<br /><br />END OF PART 1shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-76216135297074594132018-03-27T19:59:29.940-04:002018-03-27T19:59:29.940-04:00This post is wonderful. I'm on a bit of a Kana...This post is wonderful. I'm on a bit of a Kanarek binge after listening to Cat's interview with him. Thanks for providing a bit of insight. G. Greene-Whytehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16687404262559321867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-43553959810104512502017-07-20T18:22:40.667-04:002017-07-20T18:22:40.667-04:00Parent got cut standing up, he was nit in his car ...Parent got cut standing up, he was nit in his car when his hand was sliced, if police would have collected and typed the blood in the garage theyd have seen it was StevesSusanatkinsgonorhheahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06345166014895992429noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-75056265407041238432017-06-20T01:50:24.770-04:002017-06-20T01:50:24.770-04:00My guess is that Rudi would have taken it down at ...My guess is that Rudi would have taken it down at some point, its pretty unsightly in Beverly Hills and would make the property unwelcoming to legitimate visitors and would make the place hard to sell when put on the market Dave1971https://www.blogger.com/profile/03875850144566517844noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-13659519373476250642017-06-20T01:47:29.414-04:002017-06-20T01:47:29.414-04:00What is your theory as to how Steven sustained the...What is your theory as to how Steven sustained the knife wound?Dave1971https://www.blogger.com/profile/03875850144566517844noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-37222957892157532802017-06-20T01:46:16.058-04:002017-06-20T01:46:16.058-04:00Really awesome post, very well thought out, one th...Really awesome post, very well thought out, one thing i never hear mentioned with regard to the Parent situation is the blood in the garage next to Sharons rented Camaro, the blood is clearly visible in a picture but apparently was never collected and typed, whos was it and why was it there? According to every eyewitness report ive ever heard neither any of the victims or killers ever went in or near the garage yet the blood is there, the most logical assumption would be Steve Parent because according to testimony he would have been the only person in that areaDave1971https://www.blogger.com/profile/03875850144566517844noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-57363819214168943732016-12-15T00:07:35.554-05:002016-12-15T00:07:35.554-05:00Nonymous,
Here is what Watson says in his book: ...Nonymous, <br /><br />Here is what Watson says in his book: "The driver of the car had to stop and roll down his window to push the button for the automatic gate, and as he did so I stepped forward out of the shadows, gun in right hand, knife in left, commanding him to halt."<br /><br />I personally have a problem with the 'books' because of the way eye witness testimony is 'altered' with the passage of time. I am sure many here will disagree with me.<br /><br />And 'no' neither of the witnesses closer to the event mention a knife: Atkins at the grand jury in December 1969 or to her lawyers on December 1st and Kasabian in July 1970. Even Bugliosi finds this odd in his book: "Yet neither Susan nor Linda saw Tex with a knife at this point, nor did either recall the stabbing."<br /><br />Parent had a defensive knife wound on his left palm from between his middle and ring finger to his wrist that severed his watch hurling it into the back seat.<br /><br />Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06551377673977145628noreply@blogger.com