tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post7782968408305599938..comments2024-03-28T23:53:16.262-04:00Comments on The Manson Family Blog: Once Upon A Time In Cielo DriveMatthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06766282574442161929noreply@blogger.comBlogger136125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-75596200128100960192022-12-14T12:15:58.415-05:002022-12-14T12:15:58.415-05:00I get you're obsessed with Susan and all (alth...I get you're obsessed with Susan and all (although I don't believe for one moment you ever within 5 feet of her let alone spent any time with her like you claim) but man, you REALLY make up some wild stuff trying to make these people more interesting than they are. <br /><br />I'm going to start saying that everyone knows Nixon wanted Manson guilty because he got burned with the clap after meeting Charlie, Pat and Susan at a secret CIA briefing (because know Charlie was a CIA agent and thanks to Tom O Neill we finally know the truth!) and giving them a ride home to Spahn. Charlie said "Dick, for a bag of zu zus and 10 dollars, you can have BOTH these hot mommas for an hour" . Nixon took one look at Susan's mustache while watching her squat down and pinch off a turd and Pat's curly chest hair and KNEW he had to have them. He was down..afterall, this is a man he trusted with the secret operation to take down the American youth. But then 3 days after their magical love making, Nixon noticed it burned when seeing "DAMN YOU CHARLIE!" he said and he swore vengeance. No one gives Dick Nixon's dick a disease and just walks away! So he set him up to go kill the CIA targets at Cielo because they were running an international drug ring and the CIA had placed inside man Charlie Manson undercover to get intel. So you see, the murders all happened because Nixon got the clap from the Manson girls and poor Charlie took the fall. <br /><br />Lmao won't be long before people start repeating the new REAL story. Where's Tom O Neill? I'll probably see it in his new book. Bharrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06151084497035182262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-22036406976821372062022-10-12T09:43:38.097-04:002022-10-12T09:43:38.097-04:00No blood found anywhere closer to the guesthouse t...No blood found anywhere closer to the guesthouse than the spots outside the back door of the master BR, and around Folger's body.<br /><br />This according to police reports, trial testimony.shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-59275744436780841602022-10-11T19:31:43.865-04:002022-10-11T19:31:43.865-04:00If she tried the door handle wouldn't she have...If she tried the door handle wouldn't she have left traces of Abigail Folgers blood on it? Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02236566945304977023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-65048229464415751792022-10-11T19:04:09.328-04:002022-10-11T19:04:09.328-04:00Was there any blood found around the guesthouse? K...Was there any blood found around the guesthouse? Krenwinkels hand would have been carrying Abigail Folgers blood for sure so I have my doubts Krenwinkel went anywhere near the guesthouse if no traces of blood was found in that area Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02236566945304977023noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-7754933106561565022022-09-30T02:42:15.095-04:002022-09-30T02:42:15.095-04:00Dug..?
Dig Dug!Dug..?<br /><br />Dig Dug!Doughttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17388908256992077315noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-24573741598327904872022-09-22T16:37:19.710-04:002022-09-22T16:37:19.710-04:00That should be "...charming and pleasant grin...That should be "...charming and pleasant grins would say: Dig..?<br />Not the word 'day.'<br />The last sentence. ThanksFayez Abedazizhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00620902647146554404noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-15320541155704043112022-09-22T02:01:32.051-04:002022-09-22T02:01:32.051-04:00Hello, Fayez Mae Glutz here
And lemme say Hello a...Hello, Fayez Mae Glutz here <br />And lemme say Hello again to you this evening or is it a new day<br />well who cares and what the hey just take it a way<br />and I gotta tell ya that really made me laugh like 'all get out' as my friends say out in the country what you said Doug<br />that was really witty so take it away kid<br />okay that's coolhere's something I've long considered<br />but never acted on<br />and that is:<br />to change my last name!<br />Yes! Thanks Doug!<br />Now, I gotta say here too that my real last name is actually the one all my relatives/family members have/use but when I came as a kid to our fine nation (USA in the Western Hemisphere, a really goofy place to live) in the late 50's-Detroit<br />Someone at immigration put my last name that you see, which is actually my grandfather's first name and they misspelled that! Should have been that same spelling as the Saudi Royal family. So, I should have gone to a court sometime and changed that name on the citizenship papers to the simple 5 letter real last name of my family. Interesting, huh? Okay, no snide remarks, but this is in answer to what I consider a great suggestion Doug! Now, give me some advice, if you will. When I go to change it, shall I have/insert the word 'Sadie' too, in between my first name and my true last name? Or simply, "your honor, I would like to have 'Sadie Glutz' as as part of my full name, in between my first name, Fayez and the new true family name?<br />I'm thinking it was a matter of importance that you gave me this great idea, as I was gonna do the name change. <br />Also, as to the films of The Beatles in India you have, that was good to see, but why is Ringo wearing a white turtleneck and a sport coat? What the hey<br />And, of course, to Paul, that was just anothetr girl, here and there, heh and now, he's conveniently with a steady girfriend/fiance. The always cute Jane Asher. But anyway, Aha no mention of Laurel Canyon and don't let's mention one of the 'young' gir; old Mick Jagger 'scored' in Laurel. 'A hey hey hey, that's what I say.' Okay, Mick. As Brother Charlie, with one of his charming and pleasant grins would day: Dig..?<br /><br />Fayez Abedazizhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10079123484450448439noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-72880294466557471432022-09-21T23:32:10.878-04:002022-09-21T23:32:10.878-04:00Sexy Sadie?¿?
Reuters - 1968 February 20 & 21...Sexy Sadie?¿?<br /><br />Reuters - 1968 February 20 & 21<br />Raw Newsreel Film of The Beatles (just arriving) in Risikesh<br /><br />Just uploaded to YT in the last few days. I'm pretty certain this has been available previously. Perhaps in different reports of the time.<br /><br />https://youtu.be/dMoIfOOI2-k<br /><br />https://youtu.be/5Ds8nuB_uFw<br /><br />https://youtu.be/jbdKRABr53A<br /><br />**This YT channel has just begun to upload a few videos a day covering the group members and their companions/enterage in various stages of preparation and travel to Risikesh during the last few days and, I expect to see numerous related and, raw newsreel footage from their trek over the next few days.<br /><br />Enjoy (or, not)<br /><br />An extra big "ENJOY" to Mr Fayez Mae Glutz (lookwhatchyoudunnn)Doughttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17388908256992077315noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-31021880741549171022022-09-20T18:25:59.057-04:002022-09-20T18:25:59.057-04:00David, Shoe, thanks!David, Shoe, thanks!Torquehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00444301737391992929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-7142729145519761642022-09-20T17:35:31.930-04:002022-09-20T17:35:31.930-04:00Torque:
I find many homes of that era and the 50...Torque:<br /><br /><b> I find many homes of that era and the 50's had patios with elaborate outdoor brick barbecues. Yet its ironic that in all the photos I've seen of Cielo, not one of them shows a barbecue grill, even though outdoor grilling was very popular then.</b><br /><br />I found the building permit for the "BBQ shelter". It includes the rough rendering of the structure, including dimensions, materials, and estimated cost.<br /><br /><a href="https://imgur.com/BXxktte" rel="nofollow">page 1</a><br /><br /><a href="https://imgur.com/Y7N8BUv" rel="nofollow">page 2</a><br /><br />You can see that there is no evidence of a patio, but that the BBQ was built into a stonework 3' wall, in a manner similar to the main house, and that there were at least two later additions to the original footprint: one to the north side (bathroom?) and to the east side (dog room/porch?).shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-69519034248992965022022-09-20T16:20:16.892-04:002022-09-20T16:20:16.892-04:00Torque,
I have quite a bit on the Deweys- Hartle...Torque, <br /><br />I have quite a bit on the Deweys- Hartley and Louise. He happens to be the cousin of the one who ran for president, Thomas Dewey- you know "Dewey Wins!", and looks a good deal like him. <br /><br />Yes, he was a doctor and before LA was the director of the new (1929) Yosemite Government Hospital.Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06551377673977145628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-46930455726952935032022-09-20T16:11:58.470-04:002022-09-20T16:11:58.470-04:00Shoe, David, and all: you may want to check out th...Shoe, David, and all: you may want to check out this link to a video. It is from a walk-thru of 10050 Cielo Drive, along with excellent views of the guest house, in December of 1993:<br /><br />https://youtu.be/n1LfynKLIUw<br /><br />David, I believe Mrs Dewey's husband was a doctor. Interesting that the Dewey's sought to rent out the main house, much like Altobelli. I find many homes of that era and the 50's had patios with elaborate outdoor brick barbecues. Yet its ironic that in all the photos I've seen of Cielo, not one of them shows a barbecue grill, even though outdoor grilling was very popular then.<br /><br />And speaking of patio, Garretson refers to the "patio" at the guest house as being outside the door by the stereo. What he calls the "porch" was the main enclosed entrance with its many windows. It is the back door by the stereo where the Weimaraner, Christopher, came and went from the guest house on the night of Friday August 8, 1969. This door can clearly be seen in the video link above.<br /><br />And David, I for one would very much like to see a post or two by you on the main house and guest house.Torquehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00444301737391992929noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-74221622366257611232022-09-20T12:10:46.796-04:002022-09-20T12:10:46.796-04:00Much appreciated, David!
This is the stuff that i...Much appreciated, David!<br /><br />This is the stuff that interests me the most.<br /><br />Expect some permit docs as attachments to your email address, as listed on this site.<br /><br />I'll do it now.<br /><br />Thanks again!shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-86668780854260851212022-09-20T11:51:33.459-04:002022-09-20T11:51:33.459-04:00Shoe,
I have a the same permits. I remember. And...Shoe, <br /><br />I have a the same permits. I remember. And sure. I will put together a list of my stuff generally and send it over if that's a good place to start. <br /><br />By the way I'll throw in what a forensic guy said to me when I wrote those old posts there about the blood, knives, etc. Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06551377673977145628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-80672329705774734442022-09-20T11:25:26.360-04:002022-09-20T11:25:26.360-04:00David, if you are interested and have the time, we...David, if you are interested and have the time, we could compare notes as to construction history. I had written and posted an article here about 10050 and the "twin house" at 10048. I had pulled images of the permits, those that I could find at the LA Planning dept. I still have these. If you have others, maybe we could put them together. In any event, you can have access to what I had pulled, and my evaluation of the development history of the lot and the property up until 1969.<br /><br />If you are able and want to, email at sawfish666.gmail.com.<br /><br />We had exchanged for a while in the summer of 2019 over issues of blood evidence, etc. I'm the guy from PDX.shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-843479940022847682022-09-20T11:18:42.286-04:002022-09-20T11:18:42.286-04:00"are""are"Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06551377673977145628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-18806185540886956732022-09-20T11:17:39.333-04:002022-09-20T11:17:39.333-04:00Shoegazer said: "I think the guesthouse was a...Shoegazer said: "I think the guesthouse was added to, piecemeal, over the years, with no real guarantee that all of it was properly permitted."<br /><br />Actually....it was built at one time under permit starting in October 1944. It was built on the foundation of a large patio and barbecue shelter constructed in 1941 (notice there is no patio out there in 1969. the table and chairs is in the yard). It was designed by an architect(s) who would became rather famous after the war and decorated by Louise Dewey. The Deweys' plan, which they put into action after two of their sons went off to war, was to move into the guest house and rent the main house. <br /><br />If I thought it would not be rather dry and somewhat redundant, now, I would write a couple long posts about the house. Many of the 'stories' about the house are much like the number of cowboy stunt men who beat up Manson and the number of people who were invited there that night for dinner or a party. Davidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06551377673977145628noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-71849398805284457382022-09-19T23:46:05.561-04:002022-09-19T23:46:05.561-04:00I think the guesthouse was added to, piecemeal, ov...I think the guesthouse was added to, piecemeal, over the years, with no real guarantee that all of it was properly permitted. <br /><br />There are certain assumptions that are relatively safe to make. E.g., the bathroom and the kitchen would likely be close together, to optimize plumbing design or later extension.shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-63107675677369987422022-09-19T23:36:02.207-04:002022-09-19T23:36:02.207-04:00Yet again, I am surprised at how inaccurate my per...Yet again, I am surprised at how inaccurate my perception was of the layout of things at Cielo. This time with the size of the guest house. I thought it was puny and then I see the photo of the interior and then I read on another sight that it was 2000 square feet!Mr. Humphrathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02574243483977353223noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-82396689168974289552022-09-19T22:54:55.644-04:002022-09-19T22:54:55.644-04:00ToF:
Appreciated!
This is the part I *really* li...ToF:<br /><br />Appreciated!<br /><br />This is the part I *really* like!<br /><br />sawfish666@gmail.com<br /><br />Thanks!shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-8557972346367317482022-09-19T22:35:55.626-04:002022-09-19T22:35:55.626-04:00Shoegazer:
I believe there was a chimney on the r...Shoegazer:<br /><br />I believe there was a chimney on the right side (behind what you mark as door #1) that may have been for a barbecue (the plans you pointed to months ago). Part of that area may have been a covered patio (back) and I believe it had a door that connected to maybe the dogs room(front) I will send you an email.TabOrFrescahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18258408555227867498noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-2072462121363315472022-09-19T18:03:42.693-04:002022-09-19T18:03:42.693-04:00Shoe, I keep seeing clickbait ads saying one shoul...Shoe, I keep seeing clickbait ads saying one should put aluminum foil on the inside doorknob if they're staying anywhere alone. I think of Garretson every time I see it.Loegria15https://www.blogger.com/profile/05228022510504226954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-35014927522655338692022-09-19T17:24:24.513-04:002022-09-19T17:24:24.513-04:00I think she tried the door that had the most direc...<b>I think she tried the door that had the most direct path to it from the main house and/or the first door one would see looking from the main house; would that be #1?</b><br /><br />This makes sense to me, too. And there are reasons for this, I believe.<br /><br />I've read where Garretson seems to say that he either saw a door lever (on the inside, it would seem) either moved to a different position as he watched it, or he noticed that it had been moved to a different position than he had left it.<br /><br />For her part, Krenwinkle mentions somewhere (a parole hearing?) that she went back, looked thru a window and saw a lamp, and perhaps tested the doorknob. She did not see Garretson, apparently.<br /><br />Now, from #1, which is a glass-paned dutch door, she could have seen the lamp on the writing desk and not much else (BTW, the writing desk seems to be a drop-leaf pembroke table). That it was turned on makes some sense if Garretson was, or had been, writing there.<br /><br />There was at least one other lamp but it would not have been visible from door #1.<br /><br />She might also have looked in the square window at the front, with louvers inside (shown in the image for #1), but I think this may have been the bathroom, and she'd have see very little. Plus it was harder to look thru than the glass-paned door in #1.<br /><br />If she had also turned the knob, if the inside latch was a lever, as is fairly common in some houses, that would be seen to move, or have been moved.<br /><br />There is also a light beside #1, and it may have been lit because it would not have disturbed the tenants of the main house, as would the light at the pergola as you approach the guest house from the main house. I think maybe this would be left OFF in deference to the tenants of the main house.<br /><br />But if she had gone to the left, and down towards #2, she could have seen everything in the main LR, including dogs, Garretson, and maybe another lamp. This would all be easily visible as she passed the four fixed glass-paned doors, as she approached #2. But she made no mention of all this, so...<br /><br />I'd eliminate #3 entirely. You'd almost have to know beforehand that it was there, it would probably be unlighted, and to get there she'd have to bumble around the side of the house in the dark, and the moon, what little there was of it, had not yet risen, so it would be quite dark.<br /><br />In addition to the glassed-in room that #2 leads to (and apparently #3 leads out of, in back), there *may* have been another room I've never yet seen in any photo. I say this because some exterior photos I've seen of the guesthouse clearly show a stonework chimney on the right side of the guest house,as viewed from the pool area, similar in design to the two fireplace chimneys of the main house. And yet I've seen no indication in any photo of a firepace, unless the writing table is shoved in front of it, hiding it.<br /><br />So for now, I'd accept that if she came to the guesthouse, it was at #1 door. If new info comes in that is convincing, I'll reset my default.<br /><br />Do any of you have any thoughts/infromation, fellow TLBers?shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-46543653346076808622022-09-19T14:53:54.946-04:002022-09-19T14:53:54.946-04:00I think she tried the door that had the most direc...I think she tried the door that had the most direct path to it from the main house and/or the first door one would see looking from the main house; would that be #1? Loegria15https://www.blogger.com/profile/05228022510504226954noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8171370990642927748.post-32483128693768186462022-09-19T12:25:33.217-04:002022-09-19T12:25:33.217-04:00Now, questions about the guesthouse, and Krenwinkl...Now, questions about the guesthouse, and Krenwinkle's supposed visit.<br /><br />I, for one, can accept that Krenwinkle may well have gone back to the guesthouse and made an attempt to enter, or at least to look. <br /><br />From what I've been able to tell, there were at least 3 exterior doors in the guest house. In the aerial image, below, I have labeled them 1, 2, and 3.<br /><br />https://imgur.com/fFxH2kW<br /><br />#1 corresponds to the door shown in this photo:<br /><br />https://imgur.com/tazDYrh<br /><br />#2 corresponds to the door in this photo (at the far end of the walkway):<br /><br />https://imgur.com/kLKsw1D<br /><br />and #3 corresponds to the door in this photo (appears to be wide open):<br /><br />https://imgur.com/h39AV20<br /><br />First, does this seem like an accurate accounting of the three doors?<br /><br />Are there any more doors, and how do we know?<br /><br />Now, which door(s) do you think that Krenwinkle tried, and what is your reason for supposing so?<br /><br />Do we know if any of the exterior lights at the guesthouse were on? <br /><br />These are the sorts of details that are interesting to me because they can help form a concrete image of the events of the evening.<br /><br />Thanks for any help you can give!shoegazerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14073693271676337152noreply@blogger.com