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Lake was said to have been diagnosed as being schizophrenic in 1970 but I have always been suspicious that she was not. Schizophrenia is a very serious mental condition that gets worse with age. Was this an erroneous comment made in books at the time? I think it was. Because she appeared to have straightened out her life so quickly I think Patton hospital must have made a goof in their diagnosis. I'm even curious why she was ever sent there.
My uneducated opinion MrP is that it was a mis-diagnosis based on her behavior at the time. She went through hell at a very young age which likely manifested in outward behavior that could easily be mistaken for schizophrenia.She obviously overcame the trauma and has done well.
i want to see LIz pic now ( which actually I do have before she Xd it out) hahaahh
Modern day Dirty Hippie
What is she protesting?
candy and nuts said...i want to see LIz pic now ( which actually I do have before she Xd it out) hahaahhyou lost me on this?
Last comment deleted as it gives away her current info. Please do not post anything like that again.
Matt...i thought that's what this site was all about.
Photos are one thing, Jim. Giving away someones current name or whereabouts is quite another.
She looks like Barbara Hoyt's sister!
I recently heard a taped interview where Diane told about joining the family. She said she had a note from her parents giving her permission to be with Charlie and company. The note has me perplexed. For years I've read that Dee Dee Shaw, daughter of Angela Lansbury, was the one with the note. Dee Dee told someone, that she doesn't remember any note. Could the note story have been confused all along or was a note from mom a standard precaution for under aged kids traveling with the family?
Liz,If you ever come across a picture of Diane's hippie parents please put it up. I'd like to see what they look like.
Pretty much what I expected. What's she up to?
I concur with Orwhat. You gotta wonder about folk that turn their 14 year old daughter over to the Manson Family. Did they ever deal with guilt and/or regret? Were they part of Dianne's life after she left the hospital and was taken in by the cop and his family?Isn't Dianne rumored to be writing a book?
I wasn't sure whether the interview that I heard was from around the time of the trial or was more recent. A while back, there was a very old one for sale on the internet, but I just clicked on a link and heard this one. If Diane's writing a book it could have been done recently, to drum up publicity for the book.
Do we know if she was actually given a diagnosis at Patton State? Or was it like one of those stories that keeps getting passed down so that it gets accepted as truth? Possibly she just suffered a lot of emotional trauma over the way she was treated/ her role at Spahn's. I mean, she was jailbait, and judging from all the pictures of her from that time she was a very pretty teenager. It doesn't seem like being beautiful and underage commanded a lot of respect in the Family.I don't know, to me, that picture suggests that she's got her sh*t together and she is happy. Good for Diane
Patty has listened to the interview that Bill Nelson did with Diane Lake. It is fairly long at 45 or 50 minutes, but if you have not already checked it out, definitely do. Patty recalls that Colonel Scott has the full length thing up on his site. Anywhoo, Diane did not first go with Charlie having separated from her folks. She was originally from the Hog Farm and while the Manson Bus stopped at the Hog Farm before Wavy Gravy drove them away with an Om circle, Patty is not sure if their tenures collided at that time. Diane went with a couple who were camping on the beach in So. Cal (Malibu?) and then ended up living at the Spiral Staircase when that couple moved on. The note she had in her pocket Patty assumes was to go with that first couple, unless she ran into them in her travels and had them revise the note (?).Diane looks great, Patty is please that she appears to have had a good life.
This is off topic for THIS posting; it is germane for the postings a while back, when I said that Charles had been victimized in reform school as a child.I'm reading a book by Jefferson Bass, a pseudonymn for some forensic doctors who write about real forensic science, NOT "Bones" or "CSI" or even the "Scarpetta" series. REAL forensic criminal science. In their latest effort, "Bone Yard", the protagonist investigates a reform school where severe abuse took place from early last century right up until the 1980s.In the back of the book, wherein they give the basis for the plot, the authors mention that it was based on true events, stuff that really happened, and give a web address for survivors of a Florida reformatory. http://www.officialwhitehouseboys.org/Official_White_House_Boys.phpI have been looking over the site, which is mostly uplifting stories of the boys today. However... the abuse that they suffered was real. Boys were tied down, beaten with straps until they were bloody, raped by staff members and other boys, starved, and similarly tortured and abused. This happened within our lifetime.The same thing happened to Charles. He is not making this up. He does NOT have the mental capacity to have described rape and torture unless it really happened to him. When his Mom said that Charles was treated well, she was creating a happy fantasy to assuage her guilt. She was in prison. Charles was in boy's homes and reformatories. The Indiana Home for Boys underwent the same investigations as this reformatory in Florida, and similar charges were brought against this institution. Similar rapes, tortures and inhumane treatment happened in institutions where Charles was housed.I sincerely believe that it happened to him, too.Within the "Bone Yard" book, one of the characters recites statistics and says that putting a young boy into a reformatory is a recipe for creating a criminal adult.So, for those of you who are skeptical that severely torturing and abusing a boy can make him into a criminal, all I can say is "In Your FACE!"As attested by the White House Boys on their website, boys do not always turn out bad. Many of the men underwent criminal lives, and then decided to get their act together and became good citizens. Business owners and even a country singer.Charles WAS a criminal, I am not denying that. He stole, he sold drugs. It is what he was programmed to do by our society. I still believe he was incapable of murder, and certainly not of planning any murders.We reject torturing evil terrorists in order to obtain information vital to the government, but we condone officials beating, raping and torturing little boys. And when it comes to Manson, society would like to pretend that it did not happen.
Excuses are like BMW's down here in Boca- everyone has one lol...Charlie probably had no picnic for a childhood- alot of kids dont. many come from much worse situations than old Charlie did- he at least had some family around him at times in his childhood...But lets give him the benefit of the doubt...Lets say he had the worst childhood ever...You know what a Hero/Role model would do AC?A hero would have made the most of it...A role model would have taken his lessons and used them to help others, and when he got around younger people who were making the same mistakes he made- A role model would have tried to lift them up, and help them improve there lives... That's what a good person does when they come from a bad place-They dont use it as an excuse ...Diane was a lost cause- and a victim of the very worst aspect of the 60's...Back then- like today- people use good principles to make self excuses for irresponsibly..Giving your 14 year old kid away to anyone for any reason should be a jail term in my opinion. What the Lakes did is no better than Charlies mom trading him for a pitcher of beer in my opinion..letting your kid out of your site with a stranger???really???
is it as easy as writing a permission slip for a child to do whatever they choose???
Go watch that video, on the White House Boys website. It will make you cry. Then please tell me that someone who underwent that treatment for 14 years is gonna be just fine. Remember that some of these boys were in punishment for real crimes, stealing, fighting, robbing, raping, even killing. (They still didn't deserve the treatment they received in reform school, but they were incarcerated for a reason.) When Charles was 3 or 4, he was stuck in that type of environment for NO REASON, because he hadn't anyone willing to care for him. So, basically, being beaten until you couldn't walk, anally raped until needing rectal stitches, and starved is "no excuse" to be angry with uncaring authorities? Please.
St. Circumstance, you have admitted in the past to using illegal drugs. Every time you buy an ounce of marijuana, you are giving two dollars to support criminals, murderers in the Mexican Mafia. Yet you claim to have had a good upbringing and education...So, what is your excuse?
I do agree that Diane Lake's parents acted irresponsibly.As the parent of a 14-year-old, you can't monitor them 24-7.I myself, chose willfully, to associate with questionable people when I was 13... my parents hadn't any say in it, really. They could've chained me in a closet, I suppose. No excuses, I wanted to run wild... learned my leasson. And I consider myself educated and fairly well-bred, for a redneck.Charles hadn't any parental authority at all. Imagine if the people you are supposed to trust are the ones tying you up, beating you, raping you? In full complicity with judges, social workers, "the system"? Who ya gonna call?
So it follows, when friends are doing illegal things, selling drugs, pimping, even doing an execution... is he gonna trust these same beating, raping, murderous "authorities" and tell them "Hey, my friends did an execution on a fellow drug dealer"???
My upbringing was OK..My education is ongoing...I like to get high ( did not know the Mexican Mafia had anything to do with it)Im sorry for they way Charlie had to grow up- but being hurt yourself can either make you hurt others- or be more sensitive to hurting others- whichever way you turn out is a result of the energy and heart you have inside you...You should have not been allowed to wear certain types of clothes when you were 13 let alone chose the people you were around, or the places you went... I like you, and dont want to be hurtful- but the fact that you were making your own choices at 13 and no one could control you- explains a lot about the way you are today- and some of the things you say and the way you view and live life...I venture to say- had you grown up in another family with stronger control ( which is what you do NEED to do with kids at 13)you might have different values today, and you would not look up to a person like this- or chose to befriend and marry people you have never met outside of prison... They are weak people- there are many people who have disadvantages and come from bad places- but how they turn out is totally up to them. These people chose to be who they were-I have never watched Oprah in my life- but caught a few minutes of her final show...An abused, overweight, minority female... lolimagine if she made excuses and started a cult lol- there would be alot of them out there thats for sure...But she decided to go another way, and help people...Imagine that??
Shiny Happy People holding Hands...not going to argue about Charlie today... going to beach to get drunk and high..but AC I appreciate your passion and your dedication to your fiends and your beliefs...I get it that I am stuck in my ways as wellwe just grew up on differently I guess
We'll, maybe AC should move on to a better cause and start saving the children!At what point does AC think that society should say "No matter what, if you do this, you're going to spend the rest of your life in jail".If poor Charlie is sooooo miss understood by society, why are there only two people that were there that are now adults that still support him? Squeaky and Good are the ONLY two that still support him and well, they're f...ing NUTS. If AC is correct in her defense of poor Charlie, why don't the rest of them that were there come forward in his defense as adults? Is it that they pulled their heads out of their asses and grew up?
It is very telling that Family members alive and walking free today have gone to great lenghts to distance themselves from Manson and his ideals. Not sure about the allegiance of Lynette and Sandy with Manson anymore since I've not heard anything out of them in awhile.
leary7 said...Isn't Dianne rumored to be writing a book?the only one i know of writing a book is stephanie schram. i will get in touch with her daughter soon to see how its coming along.
dianne lake was diagnosed as schizophrenic due to drug use. once they cleaned her up she was fine mentally, probably not emotionally. she was given a note by her parents but manson did send her thirteen year old sister back to the parents--she was too young and her had standards. wavy gravy gravy tried talk her out of going with manson but she wouldn't listen.
beauders said..."wavy gravy gravy tried talk her out of going with manson but she wouldn't listen"ken said....Diane hooked up with CM at Topanga, not the Hog Farm. I don't think Wavy Gravy was around her when she hooked with the family to say anything.
i meant to say manson has standards no thirteen year olds for him.dianne lake's father died in the mid 1990's and was close to his daughter. he was an artist and a korean vet. her mother last i heard was still alive and they too are close. charlie manson had great potential if he had had a better childhood. he is/was intelligent and dominant two characteristics combined with a bad childhood which can lead to disaster. i believe everything manson has said about his childhood. his frustration and anger must have been enormous. even bugliosi has said he has pity for the boy manson. i am not 100% (i am 95% positive)positive manson ordered the Tate murders but there is no getting around his involve-ment in the labianca murders. the murderers as well as manson have every reason to lie. in an interview robert hendrickson said that manson had confided certain truths to him but asked him not to speak of them until he, manson died. so maybe we will learn the truth after manson has died. by the way the hendrickson's book is expensive but well worth the money. i've read my copy twice already, it is a very important document in the study of this subject.
Beauders said:charlie manson had great potential if he had had a better childhood. he is/was intelligent and dominant two characteristics combined with a bad childhood which can lead to disasterMr Poirot replies:Charlie had severe ADD and dyslexia. He was diagnosed as schizophrenic in his teens and again diagnosed schizophrenic in his 30s. He may have had fetal alcohol syndrome. Charlie had more problems than just crummy parenting in his childhood.
Liz I was joking with you-because you always find pictures noone else can find so I said I wanna see liz now if she can find her own pic- on the archives-was kidding ok:)
St circumstance that was valid point about Oprah and people handle diffferntly their problems Once I saw a man in his 40's now who was on one of the talk shows whos MOTHER sexually abused him and pimped him out to other men-yes this guy was shattered but he did marry and never had any criminal activity in his life and basically told his story i a book and on tv to alert others that boys can be abused as well...so who knows what steered CM to his point now in life some survive some make life better for others some make life worse for others,,,
candy and nuts said...Liz I was joking with you-because you always find pictures noone else can find so I said I wanna see liz now if she can find her own pic- on the archives-was kidding ok:)gotcha sista. i am a vampire and vampires do not photograph.no seriously- i take a horrid picture. my daughter keeps bugging me to let her takes some pics of me.maybeeeeeee some day
LIZ Im the same way we just had some end of the year school function with pics I hid behind my son btw LIZ I have to tell yu something REALLY imp that happened to my son but I want to tell yu in private if its ok
Picture smicture, I want to see video :)
ken now now liz is beautiful lady why ask video
Ken619 said...beauders said..."wavy gravy gravy tried talk her out of going with manson but she wouldn't listen"ken said....Diane hooked up with CM at Topanga, not the Hog Farm. I don't think Wavy Gravy was around her when she hooked with the family to say anything.read this article wavy talks about charlie and snake.http://stevenhager420.wordpress.com/2011/01/18/charlie-mansons-om-war-with-wavy-gravy/
dianne met manson at the spiral staircase house but wavy gravy did find her and asked her not to go with manson. dianne herself says this in her interview with bill nelson.
Yes, every time you smoke a joint, you are supporting the Mexican Mafia, who was responsible for 30K murders last year in the USA alone.Where did you think your pot comes from? The marijuana fairy?
Perhaps, had I more parental control at 13, I might now be a drone who believes the commercial media and politicians, instead of being able to think for myself. Perhaps, had I more parental control at 13, I would have been coddled and thus incapable of being self-sufficient.Perhaps I'd not care for the environment... and be too shy and fearful to protest commercial ventures that are harmful to all of humanity and earth's creatures.Perhaps, had Charles had more parental authority, he'd be the CEO of a Fortune 500 corporation who dumps carcinogens into the water supply outside a preschool.
Ken, I disagree, Charles has many people from that time period who still support him. They choose not to be public, as they haven't a desire for the press to exploit them and for their families to be persecuted.
eviliz said...read this article wavy talks about charlie and snake.http://stevenhager420.wordpress.com/2011/01/18/charlie-mansons-om-war-with-wavy-gravy/Ken said.....I think Diane was in or on her way to S.F. at this point. It doesn't really say much about Diane other than she would eventually join the Manson family. It does talk about here mom a little though.beauders said...dianne met manson at the spiral staircase house but wavy gravy did find her and asked her not to go with manson. dianne herself says this in her interview with bill nelson.Ken said.....Is there a longer version availible other than the 6:39 long version? She doesn't say it on this one. If there is more to this interview availible somewhere, I'd love to hear it. I think hearing or reading stuff first hand is more believable.http://www.youtube.com/user/BackporchTapes#p/search/0/S8IJ5qmc7m4
dianne was interviewed for at least 45 minutes by nelson and barbara hoyt gave an extremely long interview to nelson of over three hours. actually interview is stating it kindly nelson tape recorded phone conversations with both women then when they had a falling out he began to sell them. he did the same to ed sanders even going so far as to say the conversation between them was private then selling it. i believe aes-nihil has them available.
also i did a little research on fetal alcohol syndrome and the characteristics don't fit manson. these people have low i.q.'s and their eyes are close to the nose. they look different from people who have not suffered from fetal alcohol syndrome. learning disabil-ities would make an intelligent and dominant person even more frust-rated and angry.
Here in Florida we grow our weed hydroponically... Mexican weed ( from what I recall in high school) is brown with seeds... No time for that :)AC you dont have to be a sell out corporate whore just because you listen to your parents once in awhile and stay out of trouble...It doesn't have to be one extreme of the other...You can have good values of many different types- and there are people with all types of beliefs- all who dont hurt and steal from others...You can go on all day about the terrible things that happen every day, and all the problems Charlie faced in his youth...Life happens to and around all of us- lets be honest- It is up to each one of us to determine what we become...Charlie chose to take a happy, and fun way of life with people who trusted him- and make it into a dangerous, scary situation...He had made it through the shit- and was sitting pretty by most anyone's standards- lots of girls- plenty of drugs- and a few loyal dudes who would follow him to the grave... life was one big party.Then the true nature of your friend and brother came out...Stealing- attacking- threatening- beating- raping.... forget TLB- he did this to people who trusted him in his every day life...And you just cant blame anyone else but him....Especially not the Mexican Mafia
Just grow your own. In cali now with a prescription you can have six plants legally.
Where did you here the complete interview Beauders? I'd love to hear it, as would others. The one that is 6:39 long is the only one I've heard. Is it on Col's blog?
I agree with you St. that it is one extreme or the other with her. I didn't have a pampered childhood and I don't cling to a very bizarre mentor to guide me. What I have and who I am are from my own accord. On one extreme, AC refers those that follow the mainstream as drones, but as she parrots the ideas and principles of the other side, she herself sounds like a drone. Just a different programing.
Patty has a copy of the complete interview at home, she will upload it once back from this vacation from hell.
The real reason for the OM incident at The Hog Farm was over CONTROL. Just as Charlie would fight off any outsider who attempted to abscond with or deprogram his Family members so did Wavy Gravy. Both WG and CM were power obsessed leaders. The OM chant was an organized defensive battle aimed at fighting off a competitor. Charlie fled The Hog Farm because he felt he had less power there. The difference was that CM became criminally violent but WG remained peaceful. But make no mistake; both the Family and The Hog Farm were subversive groups of the counterculture.
Um, I didn't say that marijuana came from Mexico, I said that it is under the control of the Mexican Mafia. Who do you think financed all of those illegal hydroponic farms? Obviously, I don't believe everything that Charles says, as he thinks that marijuana is harmless, and I think that it is terribly toxic to your body, especially lungs, and brain cells, diminishing mental acuity.
Eviliz, sorry for hijacking the conversation. Back to Diane Lake... psychiatry wasn't very accurate then -- not that it's terribly scientific even now -- but in the early 70s, Sigmund Fraud still had credence, the institutions were still using electro-shock therapy and giving patients mass quantities of mind-altering drugs, and there wasn't much understanding of how emotional trauma affected the body. Herbal treatments were seen as primitive -- remember how novel it was to have aloe in shampoo? There weren't any studies done about how certain substances could negatively impact cognition -- like sugar or food additives, let alone any research done into using certain herbs, such as Saint John's Wort to impact mood swings.So yeah, Diane was incarcerated and diagnosed with schizophrenia and likely given a cocktail of harmful pharmaceutical substances. I sure hope that's over... she looks very healthy and happy in your photos.
Ken, the file is too big to upload but you can obtain a free copy yourself from http://thepiratebay.org/torrent/4481593/Manson_Family_-_Dianne_Lake_Interview
Thanks Patty, Can't get it to work though :(
ACFisherAldag said...Eviliz, sorry for hijacking the conversation. Back to Diane Lake... psychiatry wasn't very accurate then -- not that it's terribly scientific even now -----------------So yeah, Diane was incarcerated and diagnosed with schizophrenia and likely given a cocktail of harmful pharmaceutical substances. I sure hope that's over... May 30, 2011 6:20 PMMr Poirot replies:If you look at movies from that time you'll see that basically mental hospital patients either did as they were told or two big guys come in and grab them while a nurse bombs them with chemicals. Which of course is better than burning them at the stake like they used to do. I have to wonder even now if psychiatry is really a legitimate profession or not. Basically I really wonder what you can really do to help a person who can't help themself. You can either beat the crap out of them, drug them or jail them until they decide to join the human race.
I think I read somewhere, that a court decision caused mental hospitals to release their patients who had been placed there, against their wills, without stringent safeguards. Someone speculated that in the USA, this lead to our epidemic of serial killers.
The emergence of the drug culture coincides with many epidemics we have now. Illegal drugs wreak havoc in America and have since the late 60s. The counterculture gave us this horrible cultural problem. Mexico and Central America have become drug factories for the huge US market. The continent is being destroyed by drugs.
But, St Circumstance, how can anyone help their character? I mean how can you help being what you are? Once you are older, and have gone through experiences and can make mature judgements, then you can work on your flaws. But when you're young, you cannot do this, unless you have an adult to guide you, or even just drop a few suggestions.If you are already possessed of strong will at this age, then you were born with it. Some people mature faster than others, they are grown-up early, they learn how to take the good from an experience, etc, but how is it some can do this and some not? I'm talking of teenagers here! You have to be born with this strong character. No-one is born a blank piece of paper, we are more like photo negatives developed by society. None of this is our own fault.That some children are abused and turn out heroes, without the guidance of good adults is down to innate character and you cannot help your innate character.Now, once you are Charlie's age now, and you still draw no lessons except bitterness, anger and hate, then you can be criticised.
Mr Poirot, the continent is being destroyed by the war on drugs. Why should people be prevented from getting high? In the land of the free, how come you don't have the freedom to ingest what you like?If you rob someone for drugs, then you must be punished. But to take, carry or sell, why on God's Earth is this illegal?!! It makes no sense!There is a puritanism in America, it seems to me, that makes the very idea of changing consciousness wrong.I saw an episode of Law And Order, where the Chinese psychiatrist risked his licence to help a boy get off heroin by giving him ibogaine. He even had the boy taken from the police station to hospital and given methadone to ease the pain of withdrawal. But only when he was satisfied the boy was not taking heroin to get high and that it had been given to him by his supposed carer. Other addicts are thrown in the cells and mocked by Elliot as they writhe in pain. They wanted to get high, so they can suffer the tortures of the damned and maybe even die from a heart attack or hemorrhage. I thought this was an interesting comment. We will help you, but not if you originally were looking to feel different. In that case you can just scream, you worthless junkie.
Fiona, people can ingest whatever they like, as long as they don't inflict themselves on the rest of us. Or ask for our money to support themselves while enjoying their habit. Why should they play, at my expense? Most of the drug abusers ARE causing the rest of us problems. Including those who distribute and sell, since they are fighting over drug turf, and killing innocent bystanders. Don't even get me started on operating motor vehicles or equipment while high. Or giving birth to children with physical and mental defects, because the mother is too selfish to quit using for nine months. I don't know if free market trade would remedy this problem. Doubt it.
I'm sure I read somewhere that it is impossiable to diagnose schizophrenia in a drug user for quite some time until they have stopped using. Too many mental side effects from drug overusuage can be mistaken for geniune schizophrenia. I think this may be what happened to Sanke.
fiona1933 said...Mr Poirot, the continent is being destroyed by the war on drugs. Why should people be prevented from getting high? In the land of the free, how come you don't have the freedom to ingest what you like?If you rob someone for drugs, then you must be punished. But to take, carry or sell, why on God's Earth is this illegal?!! It makes no sense!There is a puritanism in America, it seems to me, that makes the very idea of changing consciousness wrong.Mr Poirot replies:Drugs are rampant now. Their disasterous effects are everywhere and forced onto everyone. I have never met a Puritan and neither have you. If you support drug usage then you should be very happy with all the ghastly social problems America strains to handle. So what if we need cops in our elementary schools now as long as your right to "change consciousness" is protected? By the way: are there toddlers and young children in your house while you are "changing consciousness?
"Drugs" is a very broad category really... are we talking psychedelics, opiates, stimulants, inebriants, anti-depressants, anti-psychotics, analgesics, antibiotics or just good ol' pot? Cause they all do different things to different people. All drugs can heal or harm, it's really how the individual uses them that makes all the difference. In my opinion "drugs" don't cause problems, dumb people & even dumber laws cause them.Howsabout sugar? Highly addictive, rots your teeth, causes diabetes, heart disease and any other number of conditions. Let's make sugar illegal and watch Betty Crocker turn into another desperate, strung-out, criminal scumbag.
brownrice said...Howsabout sugar? Highly addictive, rots your teeth, causes diabetes, heart disease and any other number of conditions. Let's make sugar illegal and watch Betty Crocker turn into another desperate, strung-out, criminal scumbag.June 1, 2011 8:30 PMMr Poirot replies:Sugar has been around for thousands of years and has no correlation with crime anymore than nutmeg does. The illegal drug scurge began in the 60s. Drugs have been in existance since time began but America did not have rampant drug usage and their accompanying crime problems in the 50s. Even pot was not in wide use in the 50s. Drugs like meth, coke and heroin have overwhelmed our abilities to deal with their problems. The hippie counterculture embraced drugs in the 60s and espoused casual usage. Even David Crosby openly admits their attitudes towards drugs in the 60s was a failed experiment. Trying to dismiss illegal drugs as a serious social problem is an example of obfuscation.
She may have been diagnosed with schizophrenia early on when she was still coming off the drugs and experiencing psychological trauma. To properly diagnose schizophrenia can take time and allowing the patient to clear up. Lots of people were wrongly diagnosed schizophrenic back then partly because they needed a diagnosis when she first came to them and partly, I also suspect, because when it became clear that she might not have been schizophrenic that the diagnosis was not revised.Another point is that back then the diagnostic manual was not nearly as sophisticated or multifaceted as it is today. The clinician did not have as many options as they would today.
Mrstormsurge said...She may have been diagnosed with schizophrenia early on when she was still coming off the drugs and experiencing psychological trauma. To properly diagnose schizophrenia can take time and allowing the patient to clear upMr Poirot replies:Ive read that LSD's effect causes brain reactions similar to what schizophrenia causes. Therefore I was thinking that Diane Lake may have been under the side effects of LSD that made her appear as a skidzo.
BTW I have read about many heavy LSD over the years and I used to have a ex-hippie girlfriend who told me she did a lot of acid back then. There is a heavy occurance of bi-polar and schizophrenis amongst this group. I firmly believe that hallucinagins cause bi-polar and schizophrenia. When my GF got into her 40s she was diagnoses with bi-polar which I believe came from her LSD usage long ago.Many Drs and researchers also believe hallucinagins cause psychosis but fall short of saying hallucinagins conclusively cause psychosis because the ex-hippie crowd is vitriolic towards any faction that dares cast negatives about their glorious youth. They believe they were God's gift to humanity. Denial is a large part to being a hippie.
Mr p said;Sugar has been around for thousands of years and has no correlation with crime anymore than nutmeg does.Yeah but try making it illegal and see what happens
Mr P said:Many Drs and researchers also believe hallucinagins cause psychosis but fall short of saying hallucinagins conclusively cause psychosis because the ex-hippie crowd is vitriolic towards any faction that dares cast negatives about their glorious youth. They believe they were God's gift to humanity. Denial is a large part to being a hippie.No, they "fall short of saying that" because there's no scientific proof of same... just lots of anecdotal, friend-of-a-friend-type urban myths... usually by people who know very little about the subject, have no genuine experience with it and have an obvious bias. Have you actually met any "hippies", Poirot... or just yuppies who had long hair in their youth? There's quite a difference you know...Denial is a large part of most human prejudice and is not just restricted to hippies.
Brownrice said:Have you actually met any "hippies", Poirot..Mr Poirot replies:For God's sake Brownie! Read my post again! I clearly stated girlfriend was an hippie. I'm 54 so I know a good many hippies. She was 4 yrs older than me. She knew Greg Almond from a head shop she worked at in Georgia.Brownie it is your type hysterical reaction and denial about my statement about drugs causing psychosis that I was referring to. You bit! Ha ha! Gotcha!
Brownrice pardon me, it was greg almond it was duane. He would ride his harley into her headshop in Atlanta. He'd park inside the store. He shortly later was killed on his bike in South Georgia. I'd say duane was one of the most famous hippies of them all. I know quite a lot about the 60s and hippies so be careful trying to claim I only have anecdotal knowledge.
could it be that people with bi-polar and schizophrenia are attracted to substances like lsd because it makes them feel better?
Well if you're saying LSD and other haallucinagins had no role in the victims subsequent deteriated mental condition and their fate was inevitable then I'd say that is not realistic.
Mr P said;Brownie it is your type hysterical reaction and denial about my statement about drugs causing psychosis that I was referring to. You bit! Ha ha! Gotcha!Hardly hysterical... I just pointed out that there was no scientific proof of what you were saying and that lack of science had more to with why experts & serious researchers prefer not to make blanket claims about drugs & pychosis than fear of a "vitriolic" hippie backlash.There's no doubt that psychedelics can be a major contributing or complicating factor in schizophrenia onset & bi-polar disorder (as is more commonly the case with alcohol). But it's very rarely the main cause. I say that after 40 years of working extensively in this field. As Beauders very astutely pointed out, with many schizophrenics it appears to be an attempt at self-medication.
Panamint Patty said...Diane went with a couple who were camping on the beach in So. Cal (Malibu?) and then ended up living at the Spiral Staircase when that couple moved on. The note she had in her pocket Patty assumes was to go with that first couple, unless she ran into them in her travels and had them revise the note Patty,You were right and I was wrong. I found the interview that I listened to, on youtube, a Backporch Tape http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8IJ5qmc7m4&feature=relatedIf I'm not mistaken again, Diane said, the note was to stay with a couple at Zuma Beach. She later moved, with the couple, to Topanga Canion, that's where she met Charlie.I still wonder whether Dee Dee Shaw aka (Landsbury) really had a note of her own.
Hey, What. Glad Patty remembered that correctly. We are still working on getting a playable copy of the whole interview up but have been busy with other things. Patty emailed Matt about it again this morning.
I always wondered why Paul described her being so beautiful. She looked like a chubby kid, with pig eyes.
daune almond? Im guessing youre referring to Duane of the Almond Brothers, or as us junkies know them, The Allman Brothers. So much for your etrnal knowledge. "ha ha gotcha"But then again everything you say must be true.Even David Crosby says so.
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