We immediately noticed that flowers are not allowed to be placed on Thursday prior to 3:00 PM. The reason being that the park is mowed on Thursdays. We arrived at noon. We paid our respects regardless.
Parent left home at early in the morning for his job at a plumbing supply shop: Valley City Supply. He returned home in the late afternoon to change his shirt and drive to LA to his second job at Jonas Miller Stereo not far from Jay Sebring's hair salon where he worked until about 9:00 p.m.. From there he drove back to El Monte to visit a friend who worked either at Dale's Gas Station or the nearby grocery store named Fry's and asked his friend who worked their if he wanted to go for a drive. His friend asked if he could come back when he got off work at about 11:30 p.m. Steven declined and proceeded to Cielo Drive.
We then travelled the 26 miles to Angeles Abbey Memorial Park in Compton. To set the scene, this is adjacent to Watts and Crenshaw. All are poor neighborhoods. The cemetery is what can best be described as a potters field. The lawns are non existent. Burned and parched at best. As we searched for the grave of Donald Jerome Shea, we saw memorials that were covered in sand from moles and other ground-born critters. Graves of young children long since forgotten. Some of which we brushed off debris with our hands as we paid our respects.
We surmised that these plots, which in Parent's well maintained memorial park differed from Angeles Abbey in that one plot equals six. In the same plot that at Queen of Heaven contains one soul, here contains the remains of six people. The city of Compton, in an effort to bury the indigent has interred six people into a single grave. Six cremated people are buried at the same time in one place. If your family could not afford the plate bolted to the grave marker then you are only recorded in the sexton's office - an entry in a book.
As we understand it, Scott Michaels of Dearly Departed Tours paid to have Shorty Shea's name and dates attached to the marker. Thank you, Scott. A noble gesture to a victim of a horrible crime. There are six people interred here, only two are acknowledged.
Last on our stops was Vincent Bugliosi, prosecutor of the TLB killers. He is interred at Forest Lawn Memorial Park in Glendale CA. It is an immaculately maintained, scenic resting place in what can best be described as a gated community for the dead. The lawns are green, manicured and attractive.
Bugliosi's plot is on a protected, celebrity list - meaning that the sexton's office will not tell you where it is. But, MansonBlog was able to locate it. Here is the marker:
Wish that I could have met up with you all. Just impossible to take off at this point in the semester.
Graves of the poor go unmarked and neglected while people dig up the bones of kings and queens. I think the poor may be better off.
Bugliosi wins again.
Great finds, pretty somber.
What's funny is they want to make a joke about the Grave rubbings and souvenir hunting and visits to the concerts of murderers, pretending that somehow the Mighty Col Scott is jest worthy. The idea that the DEATH of innocent people is something to celebrate/collect/profit from is fucking. It is why the majority of serious researchers have stopped really posting here. It is why Max Frost, Col Scott, and so many more are not on the tour. Fun Fact- I reached out to Matt several weeks ago since people wanted me to join and remembered how amazing my involvement was 5 years ago (which directly led to Hendrickson's involvement with the Blog among others). I extended my hand to Matt and he spit on it.
This is who is on the tour.
Jen- you DO NOT wish you were there
"Hey ghoulish Scott Michaels the head of a PAID FUCKING TOUR that profits off of people's death you put in a marker so you could have another stop on your FUCKING tour- well done."
This is who these people are . GHOULS and FOOLS united in Killer Love
...pretending that somehow the Mighty Col Scott is jest worthy.
the Col catches on quickly
It is why Max Frost, Col Scott, and so many more are not on the tour.
Max is out of state. Col was not invited
Fun Fact- I reached out to Matt several weeks ago since people wanted me to join and remembered how amazing my involvement was 5 years ago
Yes, we are still basking in your awesomeness 5 years later
(which directly led to Hendrickson's involvement with the Blog among others).
Um, Liz was responsible for introducing Robert, not you. Sorry, man..."
Where is your sense of humor. That was my idea.
Wow ! Peter you are so witty what a great addition to our little blog
Col Scott, are you not the guy who has made his name writing about the victims of these crimes?? Pot calling kettle!!
Claire, I think Col made his name elsewhere, in a much more public platform.
I am on the Manson tour right now, and I was there when the "grave rubbing" took place. It was done on Bugliosi's grave only, for a few seconds and not completed. Matt had me personally throw away the paper afterward. In fact, Matt and Deb announced, when we got to the first cemetery (Parent's),that we should not do anything but take photographs when paying respects to the victims. Col, I was one of the people who wanted to meet you and I don't like stirring the pot, but that is really what happened.
In the meantime, today we met with Scott Michaels from Dearly Departed Tours and went to his museum. He said his tours do not go to Compton to visit Shorty Shea's grave. My opinion? Shorty needs visitors. His grave was one of the most heartbreaking things I've seen on this trip.
It’s been a year i too a trip to California, and i am ready to go again. Interesting land. I live in Brasil but it was worth the money... an intriguing place, with so many stories.
So what’s with that mosque?
Is it near Shea’s grave?
The sense of humor on that last picture (Hi Col!) was too much!! LOL!
Thanks for the pictures, we all see the outcome of this sad crime store.
Cris, it does look like a mosque, but apparently it was a Byzantine church at one time.
Chris here is an LA Times article with a bit of history about the cemetery.
Somehow, the place where Shorty was buried by his killers looks more inviting than where he's buried now.
Orwhut, your comment is spot-on. Sad but true. In our heartless society, the "poor" are devalued and treated unfairly, as much in death, as they were in life. Heartbreaking.
Geez, Shorty got a bad deal on final resting places. If I ever visit, I need to remember to bring some tumbleweeds.... seems to be all that's missing.
New flash. All over the world and all throughout history, poor people can't afford nice stuff.
Could have been worse. At least none of them had to be buried in Jersey.
Which then lends this question of the Col- if this site isn’t credible for real scholars of the case, what site is? Since your site isn’t updated, where do you recommend?
My take is that you have privileged information because you often make bold statements- but I’ve yet to see these statements backed with facts. Those of us who aren’t privy to that information, or that haven’t put years of our lives into studying the case are in a catch 22- this site not credible, your site not current.
Or, are we to spend all of our time reading the information you’ve already posted because it contains all of the “answers”?
Personally, I don’t know or really follow the Manson case blog website hierarchy of who’s who- I follow Cielo Drive on IG because there are usually some interesting pics that I’ve never seen before and from time to time I’ll comment there to ask a question and Cielo Drive responds. I’ve got no clue who runs that site or if I should be impressed or unimpressed- I just know that person has taken the time to answer a question. Thank you!
And as far as I’m concerned, everyone spends their free time doing as much as they feel like doing and nobody is paid for their efforts. That puts us all in the “enthusiast” category- and for those that have contributed years, thanks for your contributions! I certainly don’t have that much time to spend researching- but appreciate that others have put in the time that it takes to research and present information.
You seem to be asking"Hey I don't want to put the effort in and do the work, where can I find the Cliff Notes."
The answer son is you can't so fuck off now.
There is a reason why this case is still studied- a mentally ill district attorney, a deranged cult leader, multiple home invasions by young men and women seemingly without motivation. There has been and likely will be nothing like it again. Unlike mist Ture Crime cases we know WHO did it and WHEN and HOW we just do not know WHY. Next time you play Clue notice there is no WHY card. Because WHY doesn't matter for conviction.BUT it is the only unknown factor in this case.
My blog, the ONLY Official TLB Blog ceased being current over three years ago. It stopped for personal reasons, my wife's cancer, my career and the simple fact that I no longer believe we will ever get the motive. Like Pesci says in JFK, even the shooters don't know why.
This blog started out as a fucking gossip site, trafficking in stolen Facebook photos to build their rep. It segued under new ownership and seemed for a short time interested in serious research. Then last year the group attending a concert featuring a convicted killer and then rather than pressing him on telling some truths (that presumable at least half of them knew good questions to ask) they instead posed with him for selfies. The guy present at the LaBianca house, the convicted for exposing himself to children, the guy who Helped Kill Shorty they took snapshots with. On top of that certain members started using the trip for souvenir collecting. Sick, horrible, vile.
So AstroCreep, there is no short cut to study. Start reading. Learn to question. DO THE WORK.
-Claire- writing about the victims equates with partying with the killers in your mind? Or are you just challenged in rational thinking?
- Please notice (per Monica) that the Dungeonmaster Matt had to actually insist that this year there be no souvenir hunting. These people have to be warned about human decency.
- Max is out of state and would not have attended anyway for reasons Matt is well aware of
- The first time Matt or anyone here met Robert Hendrickson was at the dinner I organized for the tour. If perhaps he posted before that I stand corrected.
- Monica notes that in between claiming the tour is not a death souvenir slog, they went to a MUSEUM from a guy that sells in a plastic bag FUCKING PIECES OF THE CIELO DRIVE FIREPLACE- is anyone realistically arguing with me about the insanity of these killer fans?
What is the governing body that certifies official blogs and accredits TLB Scholarship?
Asking for a friend.
Your friend died of loneliness in 2004
Col. I have a new theory. What if Tate was just a dress rehearsal for La Bianca. That there was some reason for taegeting the La Biancas and Tate was just to make sure they woukd go through with it. That's why Manson goes with them only on the second night. Because that's the one that mattered.
I'm being mocked by the scholars.
I’d be guessing Peter but I’d wager that was not aimed you.
Not aimed at Peter. It was a long ride home.
Let me suggest an alternative theory. Perhaps the first night is the only one that matters. The second night from Manson's perspective, no one was supposed to be murdered and why there is no third night is not because Watson stopped it but because the first night was the only one that mattered.
The second night what did Manson know as he drove about killing no one- house to house to church?
Manson knew this the second night: there would be no one in either the True or the La Bianca house. Both should have been empty. He never saw anyone but a gardner at La Bianca and knew True et al were gone.
He went to a supposedly empty house on purpose?
Then- surprise!- there was someone there and he got stuck in his own con.
Just some thoughts.
Hey Col- I guess we’re from different schools of thought. I’m not asking to bypass all the leg work and years of research in return for the keys to the castle. I personally don’t have the time to read and digest years worth of your work and research in order to come to the same conclusions or glean the same information. Which, to me sounds like that resulted in a dead end- and yet you’re still drawn to the case for whatever reasons and to this blog.
In order to further an agenda, in this case finding the WHY- you can do one of two things. PASS on useful information or HOLD onto useful information. In the Manson case website blogosphere universe, knowledge doesn’t necessarily equate to power. I respect you for the amount of time you’ve put into it- and respect your opinions as to this blog and some of the disturbing past behaviors. By no means am I kissing your ass or fanboy worshipping you because one time you used to run a Manson crime blog.
Where I come from, we help one another as much as humanly possible to ensure the success of the group- to further the agenda. To impart wisdom. To lead and to mentor. Because there isn’t time to waste years for someone to learn the hard lessons. Maybe in blogosphere land, there is.
Peter- literally laughed out loud at your comments- thanks for those gems!
If anyone is offended that we watched Clem jam with his band last year, you always have the option to go elsewhere for your TLB fix. No one forces you to hold your nose and ungratefully sponge all the work we do.
It is why the majority of serious researchers have stopped really posting here
But not you, right ?
Stating Steve Grogan beheaded Shorty Shea not just once, but twice, with the latest one being in 2017, when people who are not researchers, let alone serious ones, know this is not the case really doesn't add any credibility or gravitas to your rants.
I'm not even going to brace myself for the predictable response.
If anyone is offended that we watched Clem jam with his band last year
As far as is known among those that have actually mentioned it, Scotty is the only person that actually has a problem with what you guys did. Virtually no one has mentioned it outside of the actual 2 threads it turned up in and in them, not a person was critical. Only Scotty keeps harping on about it.
Manson knew this the second night: there would be no one in either the True or the La Bianca house. Both should have been empty. He never saw anyone but a gardner at La Bianca and knew True et al were gone
The LaBianca house, yes. The True one he couldn't have known that the 3 guys that didn't allow him to move in after Harold moved would be gone.
Grim- since literally animals piss on your postings and laugh at your avatar picture there is no reason to brace for anything. The only wonder is that Clem hasn't beheaded you yet.
Astro- I do not understand what you are saying. My entire blog which I made zero dollars off of was FREE for people to learn- sharing what I did know and seeking the truth. My point is I do not know the answer and now feel the answer is unattainable. I was hard on you but that is because behind the scenes you are unaware of what emails and stuff I am presented with.
RE Matt- notice that he cited the Murderer Concert/Selfie combo as something to be offended at NOT all the other stuff. I guess I should say alleged.
TO Matt- Sponge? I read the blog which as I understand it is the entire point of fucking blogging. If you don't like me reading it and just want to continue to be proud of abominable behavior that is on you. I am not using any stolen facebook photos or St circumstance fantasy tales for anything except to amuse myself. I am sorry that you wanted a groveling, spit polished apology when I reached out to you last month but that's who you are man.
What we want out of you is common human decency. You wanted to be a part of the tour, but at the same time be granted a mulligan for trolling us for a year. As Trump would do when your feet are held to the fire, you double-down on the trolling. The magic words were taught to all of us in kindergarten. You must have failed
Fine. Have fun with that. I’m done with you. Good bye and good riddance.
I wanted to be a part of the tour?
Okay sure that Happened.
Trolling for a year is translated from pointing out that what happened last year was not okay. But it apparently continued this year. OYE
And if anyone is wondering if I spit on ColPeePee Pant’s hand, it’s not true. I pissed in it.
..confirming once again the similarity to Trump except instead of the Steele Dossier it is the ScrambleHead Appreciation Dossier
Grim- since literally animals piss on your postings
Well, you really should control that bladder of yours. You could get some serious volts messing around a computer like that.
Try pelvic floor exercises.
I do not know the answer
Twas ever thus.
Candy's mention of, Natural Born Killers, has prompted me to ask if anyone knows the current health of Caril Ann Fugate? She was badly injured in a wreck that killed her husband back in 2013. I haven't found any recent information and hope that someone here has.
My two cents: Scott Michaels is a righteous dude who was a very generous host to me when I was out in LA last month. He makes a point of honoring the victims during his tour and I can tell he honors them personally as well. As for the tour, if you want to see Hollywood and Beverly Hills then it's just as good as any tour, so why not have a little Helter Skelter thrown in as well.
I've always wanted to meet in person The Col and many others on this blog, and I did try to get in touch with The Col in hopes of buying him a drink if he would be amenable but I had no luck with my outdated contact info. In a interesting moment of serendipity I was able to meet Michael Channels and Stoner Van Houten because they came to visit with Scott the very day I happened to be there, and Scott was gracious enough to include me. For me it was pretty freaking banner day.
If anyone reading happens to go to Angeles Abbey, please take a broom with you to sweep off markers that need it. The staff apparently don't prioritize that.
Hi, Starship, Have you ever run across Fromm out there in your travels in the Rome area ?
No, Bobby, although that would be something if I did. I have a relative who is now retired in law enforcement and I was told that they had meetings about her every so often...
But I always have my eyes peeled...
Patty is jealous that she didn't get to meet starship too!
OH, MY SIDES, PLEASE, CAN'T STOP LAUGHIN', please I'm beggin' Matt!
"And if anyone is wondering if I spit on ColPeePee Pant’s hand, it’s not true. I pissed in it."
I for one certainly do find that noteworthy. So glad I checked in and caught this, the mere thought of missing out on this sent a small shiver down my back. You know the kind you get sometimes when u go peepee.
And I find nothing wrong with grave rubbings at all.
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