1.) Why did Gary not have any defensive wounds? Was Susan Atkins really telling the truth about somebody "holding" Gary, while another one stabbed?
2.) Why did Bobby Beausoleil give Dennis Wilson's address as his own when being arrested in San Luis Obispo?
3.) Gary was last seen by a friend of his on July 25th of 69 (they were to meet at the passport office to get their passports for their trip to Japan), and this friend told police that Gary appeared nervous & distraught on the day he saw him last. Why? Had somebody already been pressuring him for money?
4.) The Tuesday before (July 22nd of 69) the murder, another friend of Gary Hinman saw him at the Corral Bar (the same bar in Topanga where Bobby & Charlie played in a band a few times together) with a white male, late 20's, with a light beard & brown, woolley hair, 5'9, around 150 pounds. This mystery guy who was with Gary was refused admittance into the club, and became enraged & caused a scene. This friend of Gary's gave a description of this person to a police sketch artist. Also, what the hell is "woolley" hair?
5.) Bobby Beausoleil, Mary Brunner, and Susan Atkins walked into Gary's house, and talked to him for a few minutes about normal, everyday things, and then all of a sudden demanded money from him. When he wouldn't cooperate, Bobby beat him. Blood splatter was all over the kitchen from the actual beating.
6.) When Bobby was stopped by the highway patrol in San Luis Obispo, he told the officer that he had bought the car from a "negro" for $200. Later on, during the interrogation, he then said that "negroes" had attacked Gary. Later on, during Bobby's 2010 parole hearing he told the board that the reason he put blame on black people is because he wanted to blame the murder on some of the "radical" people that Gary Hinman was involved with at UCLA. He also told the board that Gary was involved with black people that were radicals, and that he (Gary) was into radical philosophies, etc. Of course, he didn't want the board to think he was blaming the victim for his own death, or anything like that! (rolling my eyes)
7.) The way Gary Hinman died was atrocious! After having his face & ear cut open, he was then stabbed a couple of times in the chest. He then told Bobby "DON'T DO ANY MORE!" He was then told to start chanting again, and he did, then he got up, and went to the bathroom for a while, then came out, and lay down on the floor & passed out from being in shock. After this, Bobby went over to him, and stabbed him again.
8.) Mary Brunner stated to police that Gary Hinman was gasping for air at a loud volume, so they all took turns smothering him with a pillow to drown out the sound of him struggling. He actually died while Susan Atkins was holding the pillow over his mouth. (of course, she was always involved in murder)
9.) Manson had told Gary when he arrived with Bruce Davis "Look, you can cooperate, and give us everything you got, and you won't get hurt! I want your money, and anything else of value, or you're gonna get killed!"
10.) One more thing I thought was weird. If Bobby wasn't a "family member" as he always states now, why did he give the highway patrolman who stopped him a birth date of November 11th of 1946? Isn't Charles Manson's real birthday November 11th of 1934? Was that just a strange coincidence, or did Bobby know Manson's birthday? If he did, they must of been a little bit tighter than he lets on. Some people have said Manson's birthday is on the 12th of November, but others, including Manson say it is the 11th of November (Veteran's Day). Who knows!
11.) When Manson, and Bruce Davis drove up to Gary's house that night, and went inside, Gary apparently didn't know they were in on robbing him. Gary started yelling "CALL THE POLICE!"
12.) Gary was almost able to escape out the door, but it was locked, and they all heard him, and came running out to prevent him from leaving.
13.) Mary Brunner told the investigators that before they killed him, they had tried to talk him into joining them in the desert. They were scared that Gary would of charged them with assault if they would of left without killing him.
14.) Gary Hinman's Volkswagen bus was purchased by a guy named "Puttek." Puttek had bought it from a guy named Mark Haronson, who was described as having wavy, brown hair with missing front teeth. He looked about 29 years old, and had a tattoo on his forearm about 3 inches in length. (Could that have been Manson?)
Let me close by expressing my deepest sympathies with Gary Hinman's remaining family. I was utterly disgusted & revolted when reading this case file. From a researcher's stand point, it is fascinating, but from a human being's stand point, it is incredibly sad, and disturbing to say the least. For the full, complete Gary Hinman files, please go to the amazing cielodrive.com, who we owe a great deal of thanks to! We would not have access to these historical crime files without them! Much thanks, as always, Cielo!
Here is the link:
Bobby Beausoleil was just as much into Manson and the Family as any of the others. The fact that he is claiming Manson's birthday as his own shows that. Beausoleil just doesn't want anyone to know he was a follower and that he s not the "lone wolf" he portrays himself as. Hinman really suffered, he was tortured for 2 or 3 days, something even Tex Watson didn't do. Beausoleil is a true villain.
I agree beauders. BB was a lot more involved than he lets on. He might not have lived at Spahn ranch full time, but he was still part of their scene. He desperately disputes this nowadays, because he wants to get out of prison. Another thing, that bulldog-looking Mary Brunner should of been prosecuted for her part in this horrendous murder. She was there, she participated, and she prevented him from escaping. Sickening!!!
Hi Ann, Mark Aaronson was not Manson. Mark had a number of alias, but his true name was Marcus John Arneson. I was looking for some more information because he had been arrested with Manson and company in 1968 when Charlie's infamous LIFE mag mugshot was taken. I got in contact with Mr. Puttek and he had heard Arneson was found dead in a car in Manhatten Beach several years ago. That was correct, Arneson died of a heart attack in September of 1992. He had married in Vegas in 1977 and had 3 children. A couple of pictures of him from the 80's
Mary Brunner was NOT prosecuted because she was given "immunity" for her Grand Jury testimony (Read all about it in "Death to Pigs). The "agreement" never stated that IF she later re-canted her testimony, she would lose her "imunity." SO after she testified, she "re-canted."
It's almost like Bugliosi giving himself credit for being the "dragon slayer," BUT he ultimately made Charles MANSON an "American Icon." There is ALWAYS an equal and opposite reaction to any action.
In a recent post, many were complaining about NOT being able to start a stick-shift car by rolling it down a hill and popping the clutch. So I said you can dis-arm the electrical switch that controls the matter. Someone responded by saying that dis-arming the switch could cause significant damage to the inboard computer. YES, YES, YES! That is the point. AND any abnormal input into YOUR personal computer (brain) can cause "brain damage." IE: Bobby B., Bruce Davis, Steve Grogan. Patty, Leslie, Susan, Lyndon Johnson, etc. We, as a society, have NOT yet reached the understanding that "mass murderers" have "brain damage," just BAD guns. 60 minutes recently did a program revealing that most ALL of the recent mass killings (school shootings, etc.) were performed by those having, at least, some schizophrenic symptoms.
Remember when alcholics were considered EVIL for killing innocent women and children on the highways. NOW, they are considered as having a disease - curable with Obamacare.
The Bug also made a heroine out of Linda Kasabian who would be rotting in jail with the rest in a just world.
Yes, I know she was given immunity. I guess they had no choice. To get a conviction, they needed eyewitness testimony. It was either Brunner or Atkins, I suppose. I understand what ya mean!
Mary Brunner most certainly blundered between the raindrops of justice, and managed to avoid prosecution with a combination of hubris and amazingly dumb luck.
Stephen Kay did file murder charges against Brunner, after she recanted her testimony on the Hinman murder. She was told this was going to happen, but still stood her ground of lying during the first trial. I have to assume (assuming here) this was simply part of her dogma rather than a product of knowledge of the legal system, based upon what happened next.
Some judge (don’t know the title) said Brunner’s immunity deal wasn’t given an “optional review” by the presiding judge to verify legality and the terms. This seems like a strange thing to have forgotten, but I’m not a lawyer (my parents were married), and assume (assuming again) Mary was viewed as a young woman who got caught up in something and wouldn’t turn all zombie on them later.
So the judge ruled that without knowing what the conditions of immunity were sans the “review”, he would have to let the immunity remain intact for the assumed (judge assuming here) reason that Mary wouldn’t have the sophistication to understand the law.
So Mary gets off on the Hinman trial because she accepted immunity to testify against the others. Then she flips, and immunity is allowed to stand because she’s too unsophisticated to understand the precise nature of the immunity deal, unless there was an optional judicial review. So she’s released from the Hinman murder, to go on and engage in a gunfight, next to suburban Hawthorne homes, for the purpose of freeing Manson from the…. Hinman murder trial. Concluding with Mary being sent to prison for her ancillary involvement with the Hinman murder.
Could anyone imagine Brunner getting an immunity deal for the Hawthorne shootout? Where she recants her testimony again then gets released, only to be consumed by the implosion triggered when irony and stupidity reach an irreversible critical mass; which sucks everything in Los Angeles to the very core of the Earth. That’s probably too weird.
Gary was a Nichiren Shoshu Buddhist (NSA). Guillermo Soledad from Santa Barbara: buddhist, from Santa Barbara, an NSA and BEL stronghold. Gary had a visitor right before he died from Santa Barbara.
PS: Nichiren Shoshu is a hinayana form of buddhism that Americans can generally relate to because they focus on prosperity and material wealth as the outcome of their holiness.
oops make that mahayana, not hinayana...Patty's bad.
Bobby Beausoleil: from Santa Barbara. Bruce Davis wants to live near Santa Barbara "when he gets out."
Diane "Snake" Lake went to UC Santa Barbara. Seems everybody had friends, there.
I don't blame people for being attracted to Santa Barbara. Beautiful coast!!!
And Patty, Manson's drivers license had a Santa Barbara address. It was issued in July of 1967.
Austin Ann, yes, Santa Barbara is a beautiful place and at the time it was very hitchhiker friendly with Highway 101 having a couple of stoplights and large grassy areas right at the end of State St., the main drag.
I have relatives in Montecito, and San Luis Obispo. Very beautiful, indeed!!! If I would of been alive back in the late 60's, I would probably been one of the many hitchhikers roaming those hills!! Haha...My luck, though, I would of been picked up by Tex, or some other creep.
WOW Montecito is rrrrrreally nice, Ann.
Yeah, they aint hurtin...my cousins, that is....wish they would send for their poor, Texas cousin from Austin! Hahah....
Thanks, AustinAnn. I need to go read this. Thanks for raising so many questions and thanks for alerting us that this is finally available for public consumption after 44 years.
Big thanks to cielodrive.com for what must have been a lot of tedious transcribing!!!
The only part of this I've read so far on Vielo drive was Mary Bruners statement Was wondering if any evidence was ever found of Gary manafacturing Mescoline ?
That, William, is why Patty wants to see the "48 color photographs." Cielo tells me he may be getting them. Keep yeryear fingers crossed
If there was glassware in the basement, it probably got cleared out by whoever before the cops came. But, will the photos show furniture and a setup conducive to a laboratory environment? Also, Patty wants to see the fireplace because of something someone told her a long time ago.
So Patty so far this is no real evidence or it just hasn't been made public yet ?
Patty does not know. She read it in the stuff everyone else is looking at right now, that 48 color photos were taken by the police. CieloDrive has three of them posted, only. Patty has never seen the other 45.
Wouldn't some kind of evidence been included in the police report? From everything I have read, Bobby Beausoleil is the ONLY known person who has told that story about Gary and drugs. Why is that?
I was just going to post/say the same thing Ann!
I have relatives in Montecito, and San Luis Obispo. Very beautiful, indeed!!!
I lived in the Monterey area for 7 years and had a girlfriend in the San Luis Obispo area. I spent a lot of time in Santa Cruz and used to go to the Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk on I think it was Friday nights for free concerts. The whole California Central Coast is beautiful. I want to buy a house there when I grow up.....
According to the CA birth records Lukashevsky's name is Bryan Leslie Lukashevsky and he was born in LA on the same birthdate as given on Deemer's list. While I do not think that is Bryan in the 7th pic of the Aug. 16 raid, he obviously was arrested at some point, hence his mug shot. The police were out at Spahn many times and made arrests there more than this one time. Also, he is not mentioned in the Van Nuys newspaper as one of the people who was arrested in the Aug. 16 raid. It names all those taken into custody except the children.
Lukachevsky was photographed in another scene on the raid day. The copy of this photo that I have is a copy from the press, and it lists his name on it. It is the same guy look how he's dressed. The people who hung out at Spahn did not dress like this. Cats Cradle has the same photo I have on her site, I'll see if I can find it there.
You're welcome Suze, it's most definitely tedious
Please forgive me. It's: 'would have', not 'would of'. I am sorry! It drives me mad and I am a total Grammar Nazi, I know. In my defence, it is my job and I also have Asperger's and can't bear little errors like that.
It's also, everybody, 'uninterested' not 'disinterested'. 'Uninterested' means you have no interest in something: "I am totally uninterested in all this Manson shit, Fiona". 'Disinterested' is a very positive thing, meaning that you do something and have no agenda. You give charity disinterestedly, not because you hope to have your name on a library door. "Liz began this blog disinterestedly, just for love of the case".
Also drives me crazy, but I expect an insufferable know-it-all drives everyone else crazy….
Turists see a beautiful Coast, BUT them thar hills behind the town of Santa Barbara are full of Nazi's. MANY fled Germany after WWII and settled there. They brought mucho gold and art treasures to buy the already great estates and build even more.
That sounds like Argentina too!!!
Cielo, thank you from all of us for your hard work!
Ann said: "Wouldn't some kind of evidence been included in the police report? From everything I have read, Bobby Beausoleil is the ONLY known person who has told that story about Gary and drugs. Why is that?"
Ann, there was a huge federal drug smuggling case going on at the time: a big operation that ended up in a bunch of arrests in 1972. The last of the people being prosecuted was arrested in 2009 and the federal case is just now winding up.
Why wouldn't there be any evidence? Why would Bobby be the only one to mention the drugs? Because loose lips sink ships, and also because it was classified.
Patty knows you all think she is nuts, but the more she considers it the more it makes sense. Was the family really nomadic? Why would they spend all that money going up and down the coast? Gas ain't cheap. Why was Charlie always so secretive about where he was going? Did all these famous people let Charlie hang out because he had chicks? When you are famous there are chicks everywhere.
Start thinking outside the box. Assume that you do not know the whole story, which in life, is usually the case.
Patty is pretty sure PJ knew what happened. Only time will tell.
Does no sense really make sense? No, they were hiding something. Hence all the conflicting stores.
"Somebody didn't follow through on something they were supposed to do." -Charles Manson
And another thing. We could all just as easily say, "why is all this Hinman stuff just now being revealed?"
Wow! You put me in my place real fast....
Patty, why is all this Hinman stuff just now being revealed?
Because I write an absurd amount of letters to people all over trying to locate various files. Every once and awhile, somebody writes back with good news.
A lot of times it’s an extreme chore to even locate these types of files, let alone get them duplicated. I’ve been fortunate enough to have come in contact with a number of individuals who have really gone the extra mile to get these types of things to me.
Patty is sorry for coming off as a hardass, Ann, she is just really passionate about this and she wants people to think about it seriously.
You too Cielo. Hugs.
Patty, when you say PJ knew what happened, do you mean Paul Tate? Why would he have kept quiet all those years?
He was military intelligence and was acting under orders to keep quiet?
Help Patty out, you guys. Get Tender & May and Schou on Amazon. Get Acid Dreams too.
Tendler, not Tender. The Brotherhood of Eternal Love. Schou's book is Orange Sunshine.
Patty, I hear what your saying for sure. I haven't gone over this subject matter in detail the way y'all have. Wish I had time to read all those books you recommended. I'm too involved with Anthony Kiedis's book "Scar Tissue" right now. Austin Ann loves her some Anthony Kiedis!!! LOL!!
Patty what books are you speaking of ? I read Schous book Orange Sunshine after your excellent write up what are the other books you're referring to
Thank You Patty
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